Day One
Janel Breitenstein: All the things that I wanted to do, pushing the obstacles out of my son’s way because I just wanted to stop the pain, but a lot of times, when I want to stop the pain from my kids, it’s that pain and that, that shaping that God is longing to do in their lives, that’s what I’m pushing out of the way for this temporary benefit.
John Fuller: That’s Janel Breitenstein and, uh, she’s our guest today on Focus on the Family with Jim Daly. I’m John Fuller.
Jim Daly: You know, John, I think, as parents, we so want our kids obviously, at the very core, to embrace faith in Christ, right? So we’re doing everything, sometimes probably a little formulaically, to try to get to that point where they make that confession of faith, but in the end, I mean, it’s aiming for the heart and making sure they understand that God loves them, that their identity is in Christ, and that they are loved even regardless of their behavior. And sometimes (laughs) that’s hard for us as parents to express. But, man, that, I believe, is what’s going to lead to a healthy relationship with God through Jesus Christ. And, today, uh, we want to help equip your children to become disciples who are on fire for the Lord, and we have a great guest to talk about it.
John: Yeah, and there aren’t formulas so much as an approach and, uh, boy, our guest Janel Breitenstein has a terrific approach. Uh, she’s an author, freelance writer and speaker, and, uh, she’s mom to four, and she’s been here before. Uh, we’re going to talk about her book called Permanent Markers: Spiritual Life Skills to Write on Your Kids’ Hearts. And, uh, you can find out more details about the book, just check the website. Uh, that’s focusonthefamily.com/broadcast.
Jim: Janel, welcome back.
Janel: Thanks. It’s so great to be here again.
Jim: Yeah, it’s good. Now, let me start with my poor experience with permanent markers (laughing).
Janel: Oh. Oh, yeah. Yeah.
Jim: Everybody just went, “Oh, yeah, that’s me (laughing).”
Janel: Because every parent has one.
Jim: Well, right, you forgot to put those in a special drawer-
Janel: Yep. Yep.
Jim: … (laughs) and the washable ones-
Janel: Yep.
Jim: … you put away, and the permanent ones, you laid out for the kids and then you realized, “Oops, I made a mistake.”
Janel: I mean, at least the first thing they write usually is their name, so (laughing).
Jim: Or they try to.
John: So you know who did it.
Janel: Yes, you do (laughing).
Jim: So, I mean, you’re a mom of four, you’re super busy, and, you know, everything’s coming at you. How do you concentrate on saying, “Oh, yeah, Lord, help me today to show my four kids, uh, between all of it, what it means to have faith in you?”
Janel: I mean, (laughing) that is the, the million-dollar question, right, uh, because we can start out with that great goal, but the reality is it is the everyday habit. Because it’s not just habits we’re building in our kids, it’s habits we’re building in ourselves, you know, as parents, Deuteronomy 6, how am I going to do this as we walk along the way when they rise, you know, how are we, how are we going to make this a part of our day-to-day, even when we’re just trying to find the other soccer cleat, for goodness’ sake?
Jim: Yeah. And in, in that context, I mean, how, how are you reminding yourself to be that, to do that, between everything that you’re doing? Uh, that’s really the question. With all the busyness-
Janel: Yeah.
Jim: … how do you put that at the forefront of your mind to remember to be an example (laughs)-
Janel: Yeah.
Jim: … of Christ to your kids-
John: Mm-hmm.
Janel: Yeah.
Jim: … to not fly off the handle when things are, “Mommy, Mommy, Mommy?”
Janel: Oh my. Yes.
Jim: Uh, is there a way to do that regularly?
Janel: Well, I’m going to tell you … I’m going to give you the Sunday School answer, but it is the one that I’d start with, that, um, you know, it’s one thing if we’ve just got an agenda to tell this to our kids. It’s another thing if it pours out of us because that’s what’s inside of us-
Jim: Amen.
Janel: … and that’s what we’re experiencing.
Jim: Yes.
Janel: You know, so, I mean, if I’m trying to be the good mom or whatever, I mean, that’s, that’s a great, a great goal, but ultimately, my kids are going to suss out pretty soon what’s authentic and what isn’t, you know. That’s, that’s just the bottom line. I mean, when I look at what I’m trying to help kids do in their lives, at the risk of putting this on too human of a level, it’s a little bit like helping somebody fall in love, you know, because we’re trying to, um, we’re trying to draw their affections to somebody. But, at the same time, it’s not the kind of thing that your daughter brings home somebody who you know is great for her and he happens to have this habit of picking his nose. It’s not that kind of thing (laughing). Instead, it’s like this is the guy for whom rocks cry to worship. This is the one who elders are worshiping day and night, night and day, you know. So what we’re trying to do is expose God for, for who He really is. And so we have to experience that. We, we, we got to experience it before we can roll it out, you know?
Jim: Yeah. No, it’s good. You know, you have … and I’m sure when people hear this, they’re going to go, “Oh. Okay. Now, I get it-”
Janel: Yeah.
Jim: … you and your family were missionaries in Uganda.
Janel: Yeah, I know.
Jim: Now, everybody just went, “Oh, they’re that kind of family.”
Janel: Stereotype, yep.
Jim: “Okay, they’re out of my reach. I mean, you’re doing things for the Lord that I would never consider doing.” But, I mean, you did learn a lot, and you had, I think, as a missionary couple, you learned the power of prayer through this story. What happened?
Janel: Uh, you know, it was just really cool. One day, we were traveling on these back roads, I mean, and the Uganda back roads, I mean, it’s kind of the thing where you’re hitting your head every five seconds, you know, and you’re dodging cattle that scrape their longhorns around your car (laughing). But what really captured-
Jim: Just a normal day.
Janel: Exactly. Um, but what really captured my mind from that time is we were talking to some people who were missionaries, and I asked them … sometimes it’s just fascinating to me when people, um … to, to hear people’s faith stories of what really captured them, you know, kind of like you with FCA when you were 15. I really-
Jim: Oh, you remember that? Aw.
Janel: Oh, well, yeah, I mean, you know, that’s … there was something, there was a beauty that was so great, there was a power that was so fantastic and attractive, you couldn’t say no.
Jim: Yeah.
Janel: Um, it was irresistible. And this family, um, the woman was expressing to me … I just said, “What was the thing that captured you?” And she said, “Actually, we had neighbors and they had us over for dinner and they were praying, and the way they prayed was like God was real.”
Jim: Wow.
Janel: You know?
Jim: Just seeing that? Yeah.
Janel: Yeah, just the way that they prayed, they prayed … there’s something different about people who really experience God, just like it is for that mom who’s really experiencing God in that moment where she wishes she could really be getting a few more moments of sleep, you know?
Jim: Yeah (laughs). No, that’s good. Speaking of prayer, ’cause that’s kind of one of the core things-
Janel: Yeah.
Jim: … and how we teach our kids to pray. So let’s hit that kind of practical point for parents who are listening in or viewing, starting with toddlers. I mean, we’re probably going, “Really? How do you teach a child how to pray when they can barely speak?” But it’s a good thing to do.
Janel: It is. It really … and, you know, sometimes … I think what we naturally do for toddlers isn’t a bad thing. We start with, uh, requests or with rote prayers, you know, um, thanking God for food, and things like that. Those are all great things. At some point-
Jim: Little prayers, obviously.
Janel: Yeah, little prayers that are, that are at a toddler level. Um, at some point, I think it’s still good for us as parents to have the goal in mind, which is that the goal is not for our kids to make sure that they dictate the entire grocery list to Siri, you know. It’s not that kind of a, “Just make sure that He gets all your requests because, really, God’s a cosmic vending machine,” you know?
Jim: Right (laughs).
Janel: Instead, what do we want? We want this to be an ongoing relationship. And let’s say your toddler, you want them to develop a relationship with their grandma, who you live in New York and they live in California. Well, what are you going to do? You’re going to give them some FaceTime and you’re going to help that toddler relate and start talking about things, “Tell Grandma about what you did with your friend at preschool today,” or on the church playground, you know. And, and we start making it a relationship far more than it is “God gives me what I want beca- …” I tell you, at some point, God’s not going to give that toddler what he wants.
Jim: You know, one of the things I, I remember when I was parenting Trent and Troy at a young age-
Janel: Yeah.
Jim: … just simple things in life. I mean, the Word of God says you can just look into God’s nature and you’re going to see-
Janel: Yeah.
Jim: … if you see it, you will see God-
Janel: Yeah.
Jim: … in His nature.
Janel: Yeah.
Jim: And so there, there’s easy ways to, to connect with storms and trees-
Janel: Yeah.
Jim: … and snowfall here in Colorado.
Janel: 100%.
Jim: … I mean, just good things you can do at that age that helps them to connect spiritually to the concept of God.
Janel: Yes, that’s an excellent … I mean, just … I mean, kind of letting ourselves exude a little bit, you know, a natural awe for what’s outside us. And I think another one is meeting our kids in their pain. I, I had a friend tell me an interesting story recently and, um, when he was even … I think he was in elementary school, he mentioned that he went into his parents’ room for a nightmare, and his parents, um, I think in a good-hearted way, just said, “You know what? God is your comfort. Go back to bed,” which is, is not a bad thing. I mean, we see Eli doing a similar thing with Samuel. But he said, “As somebody who couldn’t really understand God’s presence at that age, what really would’ve helped is my parents’ arms around me, you know, and maybe them praying with me-”
Jim: Yeah.
Janel: “… and taking the time to just hear what my nightmare was about.” You know, and in that way, we really do … when we can be present with our kids emotionally-
Jim: Yeah.
Janel: … man, are they going to see the glory of God in a hug, or when somebody, um, you know, dashed their Lego creation or whatever, that’s a moment right there for them to encounter God’s presence and His intimacy.
Jim: Yeah, it’s so good, and we’re hitting on this, but as you move up the spectrum to-
Janel: Yeah, older kids.
Jim: … grade-school age and, you know, uh, junior high, oh my goodness, how do you help a junior higher-pray (laughing)? This is, this is the golden nugget folks, (laughing) lean in and listen.
Janel: Oh, yeah. Well, um, you know, I do think (laughing) … you know, when I look in John I, I see the God who pitched His tents among us, you know, who dwelled among us, and I think, if there was a junior-higher who came into this studio, what would we, we be talking about with them? We’d be like, “Hey, cool Nikes (laughing),” you know? I mean, we’d be, we’d be talking about, you know, like, “What’s going on with your teacher?”, you know, things like that, and and starting to help them direct whatever their days are, um … in, in, unfortunately, in junior high, it’s a lot of heartache-
Jim: Yeah.
Janel: … and it’s a lot of insecurity.
Jim: I remember driving the boys to school, ’cause I would do that. I’d drop them off in-
Janel: Yeah.
Jim: … in, uh, carpool line. You remember that (laughs)?
Janel: Mm-hmm.
Jim: Anyway, I, I can remember one conversation I had with them, ’cause I’m trying to … you know, you’re thinking, “How do I connect the Lord to their daily-”
Janel: Yeah.
Jim: “… life?” So we’re driving along and I, I said to Trent and Troy, I said, “You know, if, if there was a good friend that you had, and something happened and somebody was trying to kill you, and this friend said, ‘Listen, I’m going to take that bullet for you. I’m going to die for you.’” I said, “Uh, how would you treat that family? You know, what would you do?” And they go, “Oh, man, we’d treat that family so good.”
Janel: Yeah.
Jim: “I’d do things for them to reco-”
Janel: Yeah.
Jim: And I went, “That’s exactly how we should have an attitude toward the Lord-”
Janel: Totally.
Jim: “… ’cause He died for you.”
Janel: Totally.
Jim: And they just … the light bulb went off. It was like, “Ding!”
Janel: Totally.
Jim: You know, but just finding those ways to intersect in a practical way, ’cause kids are so honest.
Janel: Oh-
Jim: They’re kind of just, “Show me.”
Janel: … especially junior-highers.
Jim: Yeah (laughs).
Janel: What do you want them to be?
Jim: So you got to find ways that they could, you know, build that in to how they see the world, that’s what you’re working on, how do they see the world?
Janel: Sure. And, and, and it’s probably totally different for a Trent and for a Troy. Those were your sons’ names, right?
Jim: Oh, very different, yeah (laughs).
Janel: I mean, two totally different kids. I’ve got a daughter who’s totally artistic so, and she’s musical, so how does she connect with God? Writing poetry, writing music-
Jim: Beautiful. Yeah.
Janel: … and, and creating artwork, you know, Whereas my, my son Jack, who’s, you know, bouncing off the walls all the time, he’s the kid, you know, “Let’s send you out on a run, you know. Let’s let, let’s worship God while you-”
Jim: Right.
Janel: … you know, or, “Use all that energy …” He’s serving at church constantly because he’s ne-, he’s always bored. I mean-
Jim: And part of that, you’re hitting it, is how do you develop a habit of prayer-
Janel: Sure.
Jim: … in children, and any insights into how (laughs) to do that?
Janel: Well, I mean, again, I would come into … I would say … Let me back up a little bit, and I’d say … let’s, let’s use the analogy of a personal trainer. Okay, let’s say-
Jim: Uh-oh (laughs).
Janel: I know, right. Okay.
Jim: You would use that one.
Janel: Uh, yeah, I, I, I’ll tread lightly (laughing).
John: But we’re only talking about prayer, so you’re good, Jim.
Janel: Uh, uh, thank you. Thank you, John.
Jim: Do we have another, do we have another analogy we could use (laughing)?
Janel: Well, I have a friend who’s a personal trainer, and (laughing), a- a- and I’ve learned that, if you’re approaching somebody who’s not, who, you know, thinks they might want to get back into shape, they’re a couch potato, you know, and they’ve got one hand in the Doritos, you’re going to, you’re going to approach (laughs) that totally differently … I’m not incriminating anybody here (laughs).
Jim: I don’t like Doritos. If you said Haagen-Dazs, (laughing) I’d, I’d be a little more convicted-
John: One hand in the ice cream.
Janel: One hand in the ice cream (laughing).
Jim: … since we’re getting personal.
Janel: You’re right (laughing). Um, but since, you know, you’ve got, you’ve got that person, and then, on the other hand, maybe my personal trainer friend is training somebody who’s trying to run a better marathon, and you’ve got two totally different approaches to those people. With the one, you’re trying to just find the thing that clicks for them, whether it’s Zumba or speed walking or tennis, or whatever it is, to just get them out and, and get them to the next level. But the other one is going to eat up your Peloton pace and, and raise you 20 push-ups, you know. And, and when you’ve got kids who are that different in their spiritual development and their personalities, you know, look at it like a personal trainer. So, so back to your-
Jim: Wow, that’s a good idea.
Janel: … back to your original question, you know, how can we start developing habits? I’d say look at your kids’ natural proclivities. I mean, we, we attribute the quote to Eric Liddell’s movie character, “At least, you know, I feel God’s pleasure when I run.” What is that thing that your kid was born doing? And start there. Start with the musical kid, start with the mechanical kid, um, and rather than seeing that as, as a weakness or something that gets in the way of their spirituality, how can you help them worship God in the way they’re made? For the artistic or craftsy kid, maybe you’re creating a paper chain, a paper prayer chain, that they take off, you know, a link every day. Maybe there’s a kid who’s got physical affection as his love language, and you have a great smelling lotion every night and you rub his back or his feet while you pray and you hear about his day and you connect and you bring that day to God together. You’ve got two totally different kids, but they’re learning a habit of prayer that hopefully will stick with them. It’s not a formula, as you sa- … or, I mean, there’s, there’s some, some approaches that work.
Jim: Yeah. Um, in this regard, you included a story about your son who came home from visiting some friends and asked for some downtime. What was that all about?
Janel: Yeah. Well, I asked him to do his chores ’cause he’d been at a friend’s house all day (laughing) and, and he was like, “Mom, can I just have some downtime?” He was like, “They’re a really nice Christian family,” and I was like, “Wait, are we, are we nice … are we a nice Christian family (laughing)?” And he goes-
Jim: He was contrasting.
Janel: … “Yeah, but they’re a gentle, quiet, nice Christian family (laughs).” And I was like, “Yeah.” I mean, rather than like that kind of spa-like atmosphere you picture for meditation, mine’s more like the bring-a-helmet kind of side. That was more … you know, it was hard to picture my kids meditating on anything rather than Minecraft, you know?
Jim: Well, you got four kids going at it. Yeah.
Janel: Yeah, totally, and it feels like six, you know. So, so I, I mean, we had to laugh at that, but really, what we’re trying to get kids to do with meditation is to chew on God’s Word and kind of soak in it like you would a tea bag, you know, and there are ways that you can get kids to do that.
John: Mm.
Jim: I mean, some moms and dads are going, “Are you…no way. You don’t know my kids.” But you can achieve it.
Janel: Oh, totally. I mean, and sometimes it’s just this idea. There’s, there’s lots of things that we can meditate on. We can meditate on how God is working in our circumstances. We can meditate by chewing on the same Bible verse and really sinking deep into a passage. You know, um, we can meditate on creation or just be still in God’s presence.
Jim: Is this one of those things that kids need to catch it? They need to see you do it in order to understand it, like to meditate on the Lord, to sit quietly, that you need to illustrate it so they can, “Oh, okay, that’s what that is?”
Janel: I think so.
Jim: I think it would be helpful.
Janel: I, I think it’s 100%, because every skill like that is just so much better caught than taught.
Jim: Mm-hmm.
Janel: There’s also ways that we can create space in our households, maybe by just turning off the TV going all time, you know, or not having music in the car all the time, or maybe having worship music instead, where we just … we sing along and we start to chew on God’s Word again.
Jim: Now, I, I want to be mindful of the parents who have that child who may be a little hyperactive. I don’t want to lay a label on that or (laughing) use the medical terminology.
Janel: Yeah.
Jim: But, you know, a lot of boys tend to be, uh, di- … it’s difficult for them to sit still.
Janel: Oh, yeah.
Jim: So h-, you know, in that context, I could see parents, you know, wanting … “Oh, I heard this on Focus on the Family today. Let’s try some mediation, Johnny,” (laughs) and it’s like-
Janel: Oh my.
Jim: … “You cannot sit still, you cannot do this.”
Janel: Yeah.
Jim: And it turns into a argument now rather than what you intended it to be, which was a calm kind of instructional moment.
Janel: 100% (laughing). I mean, this is definitely, I would say, a learned … this is going to be a baby step thing, just like with, when you would ride a bike. You know, you’re not going to start them out on the two-wheeler with no training wheels. You’re going to start them off on that little, uh, is it the glide bike or whatever? They put the, their feet on the side. You know what I’m talking about?
Jim: Yeah.
Janel: And, um, you know, you take baby steps, so maybe it’s just creating more, more quiet in your home. And then I think there’s also things like, um, you know, Let’s roll out some butcher paper and let’s, um, (laughing) write out verses and, and help kids think about them. Let’s have them make posters for their bedroom door, you know. Let’s … maybe if we are trying to maybe get in a little more, to more pointed meditation, give them some, some Play-Doh. Give them some pipe cleaners. Give them some water colors, you know. Help them … I mean, they don’t … you don’t need to be wiggle free to focus on God’s Word.
Jim: Yeah, there you go. Help them wiggle while they’re learning.
Janel: Oh, totally.
John: Wiggle while they’re learning, (laughing) that could be a book somewhere down the road.
Jim: Yeah.
Janel: I’m hearing it, I’m hearing it.
John: But the book we’re talking about today with Janel Breitenstein on Focus on the Family is Permanent Markers. Uh, it’s Permanent Markers: Spiritual Life Skills to Write on Your Kids’ Hearts. This is a terrific book. It’s got so much, uh, content in it, and it’s not for- formulaic. It does have some great ideas that you can implement, uh, uh, tailor it to your family. Uh, get a copy of the book from us here at the ministry. The details are at focusonthefamily.com/broadcast.
Jim: Janel, uh, I love these life skills, the way you put these in the book, the target we’re trying to hit as a parent. That helps me at least. I’m kind of goal-oriented, right, John (laughs)?
John: A little bit (laughing).
Jim: A little bit. So that, I really like that. And one of them, one of the life skills is adoration. I, I would not, as a parent, sit and think, “How do I teach my child adoration?” It just isn’t something I would think about over my Wheaties (laughing). But how do we help our children make adoration … A, what is that, and then how do we help our children find that practice?
Janel: You know, that’s a great question. Um, let me tell you, I have a, I have a daughter who’s 16, and she’s very lovely, and I tell you what, if there’s a boy who would want to date her, I’m going to have my eyes on him because, if he will even get his foot in the door, he’s the one who’s the lucky dog. Does that make sense?
Jim: Absolutely.
Janel: Okay. So in a sense, adoration is embracing our role as the lucky dogs (laughing). Okay (laughs)? We are, we’re God’s kids and we’re the ones who, again, if, you know, rocks are crying out to worship this God and everybody’s going to cast their crowns at His feet, not probably out of obligation, but because they can’t help themselves.
Jim: Right, Every knee shall bow.
Janel: Yeah. I mean, that’s the kind of task that we have is to … I mean, as Paul says in Ephesians 1:18, that the eyes of your heart may be enlightened. We want to cultivate so that God can show Himself as He is to our kids.
Jim: You know, i- in, in that regard, I could see that we as parents, we can tend to keep the negative list a bit more strongly than the positive list.
Janel: Oh, yeah.
Jim: And I’m not talking about positivity, that’s not what I’m saying, but I’m saying those things, those benchmarks, those places where God really showed up, and to remind our children of those stories and to talk about that. And that is a form of adoration, right?
Janel: Oh, very much, very much. I mean, you’ve probably heard John Piper’s sentence about how missions exist because worship doesn’t. There are people who don’t get to enjoy God as we do, and by the way, we’re all natural evangelists about something. Whether you just got a positive pregnancy test or whether you love the Golden State Warriors, you’re an evangelist for something and you’re naturally worshiping something. So how can we turn the spotlight of our kids’ hearts toward the one it was made … the person we were made to worship?
Jim: You had a situation, I think with your husband, it was his birthday, and I think it helped, uh, the kids to learn how to apologize (laughing). What happened?
Janel: Oh, that’s a nice way to put it.
Jim: You don’t have to apologize on your birthday, do you?
Janel: You know what? It was my, it was my-
Jim: Oh, it was-
Janel: … it was me.
Jim: Aw.
Janel: It was, you know, my grief there that I needed to apologize for. Yeah, I am, um, I’ve struggled with, with mom anger throughout, um, throughout my parenting. I didn’t really think I had a problem with anger until I had children. I don’t know if there’s any moms who can relate.
Jim: Well, just for context, what does that mean, your definition of that?
Janel: Um-
Jim: Is it using your temper or just, you know-
Janel: Yeah. Yeah, I just realized I was, I was yelling at my kids.
Jim: Yeah.
Janel: I mean, to be honest, like I remember even just like, uh, around nap time, my son would melt down and I would yell to try to get control.
Jim: “Go to bed (laughing)!”
Janel: I mean, you know, it’s just a terrible strategy. I’m not empathizing with him and bringing him down, I’m escalating the problem. And I would be shutting the window so that I wouldn’t be damaging my testimony with my neighbors. There’s so much wrong with this story (laughing). But, um, but it’s been a real journey for me. In fact, I’m looking at, uh, mom anger as, or parent anger, as the topic of my next book because it has been quite a journey. But I know that on this particularly birthday of, um, of my husband’s, um, it was a milestone so we were having lots of, of people into town. I was throwing a big, um, a big party for him, and, uh-
Jim: Sounds like the 40.
Janel: Oh, well, you know, it certainly wasn’t the 30 considering I have four teenagers (laughing). Uh, so, I mean, you know, uh, everything is going okay, but I’m, I’m a, I’m a helper and I’m somebody who, who associates shame with my own needs. And so I don’t know that I’m angry or that I need to rest until, man, that ship has left the harbor a long time ago, you know, and I’m going to, you know, from zero to 120 in about 0.3 seconds, you know. And so we’re finally … the party has come off without a hitch. My husband is honored, you know. We’ve made great memories. And we’re going home, kids are past their bedtime, and one of them has a balloon, (laughs) and he’s going … (laughs) the whole time.
Jim: And watching you?
Janel: Yeah, and I’m like, you know, I’m, I’m this close to just losing it. You know, and that’s what, exactly what happens when … I mean, I know I have parents on this so maybe you’ve seen Monsters, Inc. and that moment where they, they freeze, you know, Mr. Watermoose and he looks horrible and that’s exactly what happened in the Breitenstein h- household that night. And, you know, I mean, man, I can get a lot of things right, and if I get love wrong, I really get a lot wrong, says I Corinthians 13.
Jim: That’s probably why it’s first in the list.
Janel: Oh my goodness, yeah.
Jim: Right? We do forget that.
Janel: Yeah. I can get the Bible right and I can get love wrong, says another author, I’m paraphrasing him. And so I did have something, I had power left in my hands that next morning. I woke each one of my kids up at, at the right time, not early, (laughs) but, um, just with a hug and just apologizing to them and letting them know that I just, I still need a Savior, you know, not that He didn’t save me once for all eternity, but that I need to preach the Gospel to myself day after day. And, you know, I used to think that the goal of Christian parenting was to raise Godly kids, and I would still tell you that, but I would put a big but on there, um, or except is probably the better word, um. It’s to play out the Gospel in my home, because God needs something, this world needs something more than my perfect kids, you know?
Jim: Wow, yeah. Amen.
Janel: The world needs kids who know that they need Jesus. The Pharisees were working really hard on perfection and they really missed Jesus right in front of them. And woe be unto me if I raise kids who I have control of and who are what look like morally perfect, and their hearts are far from Him and they have no idea how much they need a Savior, and that starts with me, as a mom, creating a culture in our home of the culture. And in that moment, it looked like creating an “I’m sorry. I forgive you” culture in my house.
Jim: Yeah, that’s powerful. I mean, I can hear it in your voice and, I mean, it is the key. I’m just sitting there thinking of a parenting book called Don’t Raise Pharisees.
Janel: Mm-hmm.
Jim: There’s (laughs) a title for you-
Janel: Mm-hmm.
Jim: … but, I mean, true.
Janel: Mm-hmm.
Jim: I mean, talk about missing the mark, if th- they can do all the legalism correctly but they don’t know the Lord.
Janel: Yeah.
Jim: Man, have we blown it as a parent. Think of David. Think of being the parent of David.
Janel: Oh my.
Jim: He’s out there alone, slinging rocks-
Janel: Yeah.
Jim: … killing bears and lions.
Janel: Yeah. Yeah.
Jim: And, uh, God said He had a heart for him even though he’d committed big sins, you know-
Janel: Huge sins.
Jim: … but his repentance is there, and-
Janel: Yeah.
Jim: … it’s, it’s a beautiful, beautiful understanding of God. Um, in terms of helping our kids grasp the life skills, I did want to cover the A’s that you mention.
Janel: Oh, sure.
Jim: And let’s come back next time, we’re right at the end of today, but let’s hit those A’s really quick, just give us the list, give me one or two that you are gravitating toward, and then, uh, we can pick up the conversation next time.
Janel: That sounds great. Uh, yeah, uh, these are actually partly from an organization called Peacemakers that you may have heard of. But, uh, the Five A’s of Confession would be to admit what you did wrong, apologize for how your choice affected the other person, accept the consequences, ask for forgiveness, and alter your choice in the future.
Jim: Yeah, those are good A’s. Le- let’s come back next time and cover some more of, uh, this great book, Permanent Markers: Spiritual Life Skills to Write on Your Kids’ Hearts. It’s wonderfully done and beautifully, uh, authentic. I think people can hear that in your voice and, uh, if we can, let’s do it. Can we?
Janel: Thanks. I would be so honored. This is a privilege. Thanks, guys.
Jim: Okay. And turning to the listener and the viewer, uh, you know, we make this really easy. Uh, it’s a great resource. It’s one, as a parent, that you should have in your arsenal of being the best parent you could be. So make a gift to Focus of any amount, be part of the ministry to families that need help, and we’ll send you a copy of the book as our way of saying thank you for being part of the ministry. It’s a easy way to do it. You get a great resource, Focus gets the fuel it needs to help more families, and therefore, Jesus is lifted up and more families are touched and helped.
John: Yeah, we’re a phone call away, uh, or you can stop by the website. Our number is 800, the letter A, and the word FAMILY, or you can donate and get the book and other resources, uh, at the website, and that’s focusonthefamily.com/broadcast. On behalf of Jim Daly and the entire team, thanks for joining us today for Focus on the Family. I’m John Fuller inviting you back next time as we continue the conversation with Janel about Permanent Markers and leaving a spiritual legacy with your kids, and once again, help you and your family thrive in Christ.
Day Two
Janel Breitenstein: I used to think that the goal of Christian parenting was to raise Godly kids, and I would still tell you that, but I would put a big but on there, um, or accept is probably the better word. Um, it’s to plant the gospel in my home, because God needs something … This world needs something more than my perfect kids.
Jim Daly: Wow, yeah.
Janel: You know?
Jim: Amen.
Janel: The world needs kids who know that they need Jesus.
John Fuller: Janel Breitenstein is once again our guest on Focus on the Family with Jim Daly, and I’m John Fuller.
Jim: Here’s something to think about, John. We want our children to be spiritually healthy, emotionally healthy, physically healthy, right? That’s kind of the norm.
John: Oh, yeah.
Jim: And oftentimes in this life, there’s something being attacked in one of those three spheres typically, and it’s rare that a child is healthy in every place, and if they are, you should be praising God for that.
Janel: Mm-hmm.
Jim: And if they’re not, you need to think of strategies, as a parent, to help them, and we want to cover how to help with that spiritual development today. Uh, you might be saying, “Where do I start? I don’t even know where to begin.” Well, our guest has some great ideas, and, uh, we talked about this last time. If you missed it, go to the website or download the app for-
John: Mm-hmm.
Jim: … Focus on the Family broadcast. You get access to the entire library. But, uh, Janel, our guest talked so well about how to keep your child’s spiritual best interest in mind and how to nurture your child’s devotion to the Lord in so many ways, and we’re gonna continue that discussion today.
John: And Janel Breitenstein is back with us again. She’s the mom to four. She and her husband, John, uh, live not too far away from Colorado Springs here. Uh, she’s an author, a freelance writer, and a popular speaker, and, uh, we’re talking about an excellent book she’s written. Uh, it includes a group discussion guide. Uh, actually it’s called Permanent Markers: Spiritual Life Skills to Write on Your Kids’ Hearts. And we’ll encourage you to learn more about Janel and to, uh, find out more about the book when you stop by focusonthefamily.com/broadcast.
Jim: Janel, welcome back.
Janel: Hey, thanks. It’s so good to be back, guys.
Jim: Yeah. And, uh, man, we covered some territory last time.
Janel: Yeah.
Jim: I think for, you know … It, it sounds like, “Duh?”
Janel: (laughs)
Jim: I … Uh, some parents are in the groove, and they’re doing it … They probably don’t even comprehend the rest of us that might not think so soberly-
Janel: Mm-hmm.
Jim: … about, “How do we intentionally stir our little ones toward that relationship with the Lord?,” very intentionally, every day, every moment that we can, that it’s not unnatural to do so, uh, and, and you really raise that. Give us the quick synopsis last time … How would you, uh, kinda cover the ground in one minute that we covered for 30 minutes yesterday?
Janel: (laughs) Sure. I mean, you … Right now, we’ve been talking about spiritual life skills. I mean, we talk about, you know, we do all these things every day for our kids, whether it’s cutting hotdogs in pieces so they don’t choke.
Jim: (laughs)
Janel: You know, or helping them to clean a toilet, like Will, and not disgustingly … You know, or helping them to tie their shoes. (laughs)
Jim: What age did you start the toilet-cleaning? I’d like to-
Janel: Ah, there’s the question.
Jim: Yeah.
Janel: As early as I could.
Jim: Like five?
Janel: I don’t know, probably. I mean, as long as you know they’re not going to create a huger me- Uh, more huge mess after it, (laughs) you know?
Jim: But, uh, you-you … But, you, what you’re saying is you begin to do these practical teachings. Wu-what greater practical teaching than spiritual?
Janel: Sure. And as early as they can, and you’re doing things that are, that are, you know … Uh, uh, as age-appropriate as possible, you-you’re starting as early as you can, and that starts with, with your child before they’re even verbal. You know, you, you might teach them, um, to do, at least when, when I was a young mom, baby signs were things, so we teach them to say thank you, you know, to start cultivating gratitude in your child’s heart before they could even say thank you, you know? And so we’re, we’re praying with our kids before that, or you, young moms who are not getting any sleep, or you, young dads who aren’t getting any sleep, you’re laying the foundation for God’s love by just responding to the cries of your child.-
Jim: Mm-hmm.
Janel: … keeping them in clean diapers, building attachment with them. Those are all foundational. So at each and every age, there are different appropriate life skills that we’re teaching our kids so they can see God’s face-
Jim: Yeah.
Janel: … and appreciate Him, and follow Him, and love Him-
Jim: Yeah. Yeah.
Janel: … with their lives.
Jim: And I really appreciate it. We talked about your meditation, how to teach your kids how to be still, uh, before the Lord. I mean, that can be a challenge. (laughs)
Janel: Yeah.
Jim: And we talked about that, but there’s good stuff last time. We wanna keep moving today and cover some more, uh, territory that you covered in your great book, Permanent Markers. Uh, you mentioned in the book the importance of these spiritual skills, these life skills to develop in your children. And the first one, I wanna, uh, bring up today is self-control, (laughs) and every mom goes, “Yay, self-control.”
Janel: (laughs)
Jim: I mean, seriously, you’re gonna teach a four-year-old self-control. Wu-what are you getting at, and what’s age-appropriate in terms of expectations so we don’t end up in a bad place?
Janel: Oh, I think that’s a great question, because, um, honestly, um, even just understanding a little bit about how our kids’ brains develop and how they operate under stress is very helpful. We’ve got knowledge now from neuropsychology that teaches us that, you know, um, beneath the kids’ prefrontal cortex that is gonna be developing until they’re 25 or 30. They’ve got, um, what some psychologist would call an animal brain. I mean, we’ve had the-
Jim: The lizard brain, I believe.
Janel: We have the same designer. You’re right. You’re right.
Jim: (laugh)
Janel: I mean, we have the same designer, right? So, but ours is, is overlaid with … Uh, I will, in my non-neuropsychologist language, uh, say that that prefrontal cortex is a bit of a image of God parts our brain that gives us self-control, that gives us impulse control, that gives us-
Jim: Wisdom.
Janel: … wisdom, it gives us an ability to empathize. You know, all the … Uh, make intelligent decisions and things like that, but that’s still developing in a four-year old, and if he hasn’t had a snack and he’s got low blood sugar, and you’re in the housewares aisle, you know, I mean, you-you might be looking at a meltdown if he hasn’t had his nap.
Jim: (laughs)
Janel: You know? And, and that’s … That kind of makes sense, but if we’re going to try to teach self-control, that’s an issue of … In that circumstance, to me, that’s mostly, uh, a childishness issue, not a rebellion issue.
Jim: You know, when you look at self-control, boy, you look at the culture broadly, and it’s as if it’s unleashed-
Janel: Oh, wow. Yeah. Mm-hmm.
Jim: … this idea of lack of self-control-
Janel: Yeah.
Jim: … whether we see it on social media, or cable news, or, you know-
Janel: It’s not a popular virtue, per se.
Jim: You know.
Janel: No.
Jim: Uh, it … But it’s in, in such volume today-
Janel: Yeah.
Jim: … that our kids are absorbing it, you know, this lack of, uh, self-control, especially around what you think is not necessarily what you should say.
Janel: Oh, yeah.
Jim: I mean, ’cause we just say things now because we have this autonomy, especially in social media. And ha-how do we begin to teach our children who are gonna be saturated in social media, in, uh, the internet and all the other things that are, you know, digital natives are now born into? How do, how we help them, uh, demonstrate self-control at an early age, and then maintain that through teenhood?
Janel: Huh. Well, and I would definitely say-
Jim: (laughs)
Janel: … start earlier than when they’re teens, is (laughs) point number one.
Jim: Yeah. You have to.
Janel: (laughs) You really … You really do.
Jim: It’s a skillset.
Janel: Yeah. And-and we’re, we’re, uh, in that … You know, before they get to be teenagers, hopefully we’re teaching them skills like, number one, counter to what the culture is telling us, that being yourself … We, we have associated that with honesty and virtue, but the reality is we’re all curating constantly what we’re going to put forward the, you know, what parts of us we’re gonna put forward, and there’s a part of this that the Bible says very explicitly, that it, um … You know, Ephesians 4:29, we’re to say what is only gracious and-f, and is building up that’s not destructive, you know, and we’re only supposed to say things that are full of grace and that are appropriate for the occasion. “Wow, does that restrict? If I put that rule over my mouth, that restricts a lot of things I can say.” So, uh, I’m, I’m learning that to be yourself is actually to be more in the image of God, not the image of me, and, and I’m learning that my identity doesn’t come through what others think of me, or what I do, or what I have, you know, including my reputation, and if we can solidify that sense of identity, it’s a whole lot easier to have self-control when they get older.
Jim: Well, now, and this is … I appreciate (laughs) your authenticity in the book-
Janel: (laughs)
Jim: The yell jar.
Janel: (laughs)
Jim: You know, now, I’m thinking, “Do … Is this a jar you put to your mouth and go, ‘Hey, dinner time!’”
Janel: (laughs)
Jim: It’s not that kind of yell jar.
Janel: Oh, no. I mean-
Jim: (laughs)
Janel: I-I, I talked in the last episode that we had here, that, um, uh, a journey of, of parent anger has been part of, of my testimony, God showing me that how I identify with my kids in conflict is a chance to replay how He worked out His conflict with me, you know? And so I needed to get my anger under control with my kids, and so we put a yell jar in our house, where if the kids yelled, they had to put a certain amount in the jar. And for my husband and I, we have to put in $5 if we yell, you know? And, uh, I mean, I don’t know, I’m financially motivated.
Jim: (laughs)
Janel: But, you know, there’s other things-
Jim: Yeah.
Janel: … that like, like push-ups I … Uh, there’s one summer where I decided if my kids lost their cool, they were gonna need to do push-ups, and I had to get down and do some push-ups. And it was funny ’cause my son and I are doing push-ups together, and he goes, “I’m gonna be so ripped by the time this (laughs) summer is over.”
Jim: Oh, yeah. (laughs) That’s not the goal. That is not the goal.
Janel: (laughs) That is not the goal.
Jim: (laughs). You do push-ups on your own too, right?
Janel: (laughs) Yeah.
Jim: That’s so funny, but, uh, the big question is, you know, how do you dispense the dollars?
Janel: Uh, well, I mean-
Jim: (laughs)
Janel: … good question, but … I mean, I think as a family, we, we could decide, you know, on a non-profit.
Jim: Time for ice cream.
Janel: Hah, or (laughs) Häagen-Dazs, of course.
Jim: Or Häagen-Dazs. There we go.
Janel: (laughs)
Jim: Another of those great life skills is simplicity. Now, (laughs) you’re talking.
Janel: Yeah.
Jim: And we could run up the, the train here from toddler to, you know, elementary school, junior high, high school kids, but yeah, “Teach me simplicity, mom.” What does that mean?
Janel: You know, I mean, it’s … Uh, this has been so changed from my experience, living in Africa, that sometimes it’s hard for me to understand what it really looks like. Um, I’ve, I’ve lived among the way that 60 to 80% of the world lives, and it’s with the whole lot less stuff, and actually, they were people who … In my experience, uh, uh, granted, it was only for five years, but they were a lot happier than Americans.
Jim: Oh, I saw that first hand.
Janel: You know?
Jim: Yeah, it’s convicting.
Janel: And, it is. And it is, and … But it’s so in line with Jesus’ teaching, that a man’s life does not consist in the abundance of His possessions, you know? So how can we continue to just choose simpler with our kids, whether it’s, you know, we’re gonna have, um, maybe meat at few of our meals, um, because a lot of the world doesn’t have this, or maybe we just need to have one side dish or not two, or maybe, um, we have a one in, one out policy with our kids’ closets that, uh-
Jim: (laughs)
Janel: … That, you know?
Jim: I like this.
Janel: Yeah. If we get one toy, or we get another shirt or something, we, we get rid of one, or we always have that.
Jim: Could we do that for the garage?
Janel: Oh, my word.
Jim: (laughs) One thing you throw out there-
Janel: (laughs) Oh.
Jim: … one thing gets thrown back in your closet. (laughs)
Janel: Careful, that’s sacred ground here. I’m just letting you know people …
Jim: The happiness has come.
Janel: … How people feel about their garages. (laughs)
Jim: (laughs)
Janel: You know, but there’s so many ways that we can just choose less-
Jim: Mm-hmm.
Janel: … things, um, and just really think, “Do I, do I really need this?,” because it’s, it’s confusing to me even, um, coming back, um, from Africa. I get confused with what I want and what I need. It’s very easily confused, and, um, we’re just being fed marketing constantly, whether it’s on Pinterest or whatever. We’re being fed the idea that, “If I just have this, this beauty product or whatever, um-”
Jim: Mm-hmm.
Janel: … “Man, will my life sing.”
John: Yeah. Well, our guest today on Focus on the Family is Janel Breitenstein, and we’re so glad to have you joining us. Um, we’re talking about a lot of the content in her book, Permanent Markers: Spiritual Life Skills to Write on your Kids’ Hearts. And, uh, we’d be happy to tell you more about getting a copy of the book, or reach out to us when you call 800-A-FAMILY, or stop by focusonthefamily.com/broadcast.
Jim: Uh, Janel, as a missionary family, first of all, you hear angelic music around this com-
Janel: (laughs)
Jim: … commitment that you and your husband made. And of course, you do everything correctly, and-
Janel: Oh, yeah.
Jim: You know, that’s-
Janel: Sure.
Jim: That’s the imagery it can have.
Janel: Yeah.
Jim: But, uh, and again, I just so love your openness and your truthfulness-
Janel: (laughs)
Jim: … and your, your screaming jar, yell jar. (laughs)
Janel: (laughs)
Jim: I just … (laughs) I think Jean and I could relate to that.
John: Yell, scream, wa-one of those things.
Janel: (laughs) Oh, yes.
Jim: Yeah, yeah. Uh, no kidding. But i-in that context, uh, you’re serving others. You know how to serve.
Janel: Yeah.
Jim: I mean, you’ve made this big decision to be a missionary. So your children are watching all this, trying to teach them how to put others first. Uh, how did your kids serve in that context, or how do they pick it up?
Janel: You know, that was part of the, part of the question that m-my husband and I were asking ourselves at the time because we just realized that … I mean, okay, being in a McDonald’s doesn’t make you a hamburger, you know, and being, uh, the child of a, of a missionary certainly does not mean you’re a perfect child.
Jim: Well, and, and, in fact, uh, I was gonna add that, but I didn’t wanna be too insensitive, a lot of missionary kids struggle-
Janel: Oh, yeah.
Jim: … ’cause they feel they were sacrificed-
Janel: Oh, very much.
Jim: … for their parents’ vision and, and, and service.
Janel: Very much. The, the issue is that missionary kids deal with are profound, and, and my kids are part of those. I am not sitting here because I have perfect children, not one iota.
Jim: (laughs)
Janel: A-and we had to put our pants on one leg at a time, just like everybody else, um, and that meant that our kids also, you know, pack theirs in their carry-ons, just like their parents did. And, um, you know, so as my husband and I were just looking at, “How can we continue to kinda knead this into their souls?,” you know, um-
Jim: Mm-hmm.
Janel: … there was an opportunity with, uh, a little lending library that was run by a couple of, um, Korean missionaries, and, um, I mean, what my kids could offer is that they were literate, and so we asked if we could do a Bible story time. They done … My kids had done Bible story time in the United States, and so we would … They would each, um, bring a book … Mu- Each of my kids would bring a book, you know, Harold and the Purple Crayon or Frog and Toad, or whatever, to, to read there, and we would bring crafts. And we had kids, you know, older siblings hauling in their diaperless toddlers that they had been in charge of, the kids are eating the crayons and peeing on the floor. I mean, it was like-
Jim: (laughs)
Janel: … no other library story time that you’d ever seen. We walked by this goat every time that, I think, was eternally pregnant. I don’t know if it ever gave birth.
Jim: (laughs)
Janel: But, um, (laughs) but, you know, the idea was to say … You know, no matter how old you are, not that you’re superior, that was not the goal at all, that you have something to give, you know. And not only that, but that, um, no matter who you are, there’s somebody’s feet you can wash.
Jim: Wow. That’s powerful. In that context, you kinda developed this in your outline in the book, this idea of self-righteous service-
Janel: Oh, wow. Yeah.
Jim: … versus authentic service. That really caught my attention ’cause I’ve never really put it into those categories. So ha-how did you, yeah, A, discover this, and then how did you teach that differential to your children?
Janel: Well, I had to have some help with, uh, from Richard Foster on this one, you know, his book, Celebration of Discipline, um, and, uh, some of his other writings, um, but this is something that I’ve had to work at, as somebody who is probably more natural Pharisee. I’m a natural helper, natural achiever, and I can … My cravings can get religion, you know, and part of that is for me to look good, you know, or to-
Jim: (laughs)
Janel: … be good to God. And, man, is that dangerous if this service lifestyle that we’re trying to teach our kids is actually just another, you know, feather in their cap on why-
Jim: Like, “Look at me.”
Janel: Yeah, on why they’re more worthy to God. I mean, uh, woe beyond to us. Again, If we, if we take from the gospel with our kids serving, they, they need Jesus. (laughs)
Jim: But even in that context, you have to recognize it, as the parent-
Janel: Yeah.
Jim: And then, you have to teach it-
Janel: Sure.
Jim: … in a healthy direction. So what would be some things like you would notice in your kids when they were doing an act of service, that they were maybe a little wobbly in this area, maybe when they were wanting to be noticed?
Janel: Sure.
Jim: So how did you deal with it?
Janel: Yeah, very much. I would say, you know, noticing that wu-when your kids prefer the big, sparkly jobs, even in the sense of, “Well, I’ll read … I’ll be the kid who reads in front of the story time, but I’m not willing to help with my sibling who needs a diaper change,” you know, or, um, you know, self-righteous service is gonna calculate the results and expect gratitude in compensation. You know, and I, I know I had, um, my son, Jack, who really does love to serve. He was like, “Well, everybody else, when they’re in the sound booth, they always get … Somebody tells them, ‘Good job,’ and nobody tells me.” And, you know, I wanna first empathize with that. I think that’s important.
Jim: Yeah.
Janel: But also, can we just find happiness in service itself and in being unseen, the God who, who sees us, you know? I mean, self-righteous service picks and chooses who to serve mostly because of their image, but authentic service is really indifferent to an audience, and they don’t really notice whether others-
Jim: Yeah.
Janel: … are watching. You know, there’s a self-forgetfulness, you know, or a, um, that we’re looking for. We don’t want our kids to be blown around by their moods and their impulses, um, or putting others in their debt, even worse. You know, “Well, I did this.” You know? I mean, kids are notorious for that, thinking that that’s just as, “Well, I did this. Why doesn’t he have to do that to me?” You know? But instead, authentic services is this lifestyle of building community and being unpretentious, you know, putting nobody under obligation. Those are great things to just keep an eye out. We’re looking out not for, again, just the, just the outer work with our kids. What’s going on in their heart? What’s their heart landscape like?
Jim: You know, uh, the three of us, John, uh, we have together 12 children, right?
Janel: Wow, yeah.
Jim: I mean, all three of us. You have four. John has six. I have two. I think my math is correct.
Janel: Mine feels like six. Does that matter?
John: Correct, yup.
Jim: (laughs) What’s that?
Janel: Mine feels like six. Does that matter?
Jim: (laughs) Yeah. That’s the multiplier effect.
Janel: (laughs)
Jim: My question is this, though, with 12 children in our mutualness-
Janel: Yeah.
Jim: … so to speak, uh, i-is this something when it comes to sacrifice to service toward others? Have you seen it be more of an innate attribute or one that is crafted, uh, for the child by the parent? Uh, I could just say between my two kids, one of them leans more into this naturally. They are looking for that opportunity. It just comes to them more natural, I could see it. It doesn’t diminish the other, who’s more objective, more kind of, um, scientifically-oriented-
Janel: Mm-hmm.
Jim: But the other one, his heart is just open to this. It’s like-
Janel: Mm-hmm.
Jim: … “What can I do? How can I help you?”
Janel: That’s a gift.
Jim: A-and so I’m asking that question, uh, uh, “How do you nurture it in the natural bit, and then how do you nurture it in the unnatural (laughs) bit like-
John: Mm-hmm.
Janel: Sure.
Jim: “Let’s go,” and then not make those comparisons to belittle the one that doesn’t possess it.
Janel: Sure. I mean, what a great question ’cause you definitely don’t want … You’d be like, “Well, if you were only more like your brother.” I mean, wow, that’s a-
John: Oh, yeah.
Jim: Exactly, hooh!
Janel: I think the whole book of Genesis is like, “Please don’t do that.”
Jim: (laughs) Yeah, please don’t do that.
Janel: Um, uh, but, uh, but I do think, okay, in the child who’s naturally, we’re gonna say more thoughtful, you know, because that’s a lot of times where the service comes from. They just have eyes that see, or maybe they’re that firstborn, who loves to, you know, they’re, they’re a pleaser, you know? What a wonderful gift to praise in them, and at the same time, you know, pull them aside every now and then. Uh, remind them of the gospel to them, that they are not what they do for you, that they … Your identity does not rest on them.
Jim: Mm-hmm.
Janel: You know, as a parent, you don’t need them to be the, the star, the shining star-
Jim: It’s a good lesson.
Janel: … of the family. I mean, it’s, it’s hard as a firstborn. Personally, I, I probably … It’s always good when somebody’s like, “Hey, just a reminder, you’re not what you do.”
Jim: Yeah.
Janel: “And you’re not what others think of you.”
Jim: You’re not your label.
Janel: You’re not that. Um, so just be more cautious of the, of the inner world of the other child, for the child who doesn’t do that more naturally. I mean, this is a habit that we’re building in kids to be thoughtful and to just see others. So, I mean, maybe that’s as simple as when you’re going out of the bathroom at the airport, and somebody’s there, cleaning up the paper towels, you thank them for their service, and thank them for what they do in the community, you know, or, or you, that grocery cashier, you strike up a conversation with them, and, um, you know, you’re just showing value to every socio-economic level, and then you could just, um … You, you model service and you ask your child. Uh, I mean, at some point, we are conscripting our kids into service. There’s just no way around it-
Jim: Yeah.
John: Mm-hmm.
Janel: … because their hearts are not naturally going to want to serve. But again, before they go into a situation, “Hey, grandma, I bet she’s in a stressful situation ’cause it’s Thanksgiving day. Do you wanna say, “I know you’re really good at helping clear the table. Would you want to do that after dinner today?” You know, just kinda calling that out and setting kids up for success in that way, helping them see the needs before they even happen so they’re like, “Hey, that’s my queue.”
Jim: Yeah. Janel, uh, lastly and, uh-
Janel: Sure.
Jim: Again, we haven’t been able to cover everything ’cause your book is so full of great stuff-
Janel: Thank you.
Jim: And typically, we’re just scratching the surface so people get a hint at what’s in there. And, uh, and hopefully they’ll pick up the resource and we’ll give you details of how to do that in a minute. Uh, resiliency is always talked about-
Janel: Mm-hmm
Jim: … by a child psychologist.
Janel: Yeah.
Jim: Christian, non-Christian doesn’t matter. This is a common, important characteristic-
Janel: Mm-hmm.
Jim: … that your children possess. I feel like somehow, the Lord got that. And to me, as an orphan kid, I was really resilient probably because of those valleys.
Janel: Oh, yeah.
Jim: You have to learn who you are pretty quickly.
Janel: You can’t be anything else, probably. (laughs)
Jim: Then, you get this … Yeah. And you got to decide, “Okay, how do, how do I survive?”
Janel: Yeah.
Jim: That’s resiliency.
Janel: Yeah.
Jim: You’re gonna do what needs to be done in order-
Janel: Right.
Jim: … to be able to wake up tomorrow, and do what you need to do tomorrow. Um, but in that context, I think your son, Will had a, uh, a little bit of a struggle and developed strength and resiliency. What happened with Will and, and speak to the importance of resiliency?
Janel: Very much so. Um, my son, Will, uh, when he was 13, uh, came down from a shower one night, and, um, you know, his skin was all warm and, and he said, “Mom, feel this,” and he had a hard lump in his neck. And, um, just context in our family, we had just lost a toddler, friend of ours to cancer, uh, uh, three-year struggle with cancer.
Jim: Yeah.
Janel: And, um, you know the worst things go galloping through a mom’s heart-
Jim: Sure.
Janel: … at that point, but we, um, you know, uh, obviously, on the exterior, I’m thinking, “Don’t add to drama.” We just, you know, “Hmm, that’s interesting. It’s really good that you showed me that. Let’s just make an appointment so that, you know, we can just figure out what’s going on and how God made your body right now.” So it was, that was the beginning of a six-week journey. Um, we did get an MRI, and they said that lymphoma was a primary concern, and so we took him up to Denver Children’s, and, um, he had to do an MRI with contrast. Actually, excuse me, the, the previous test was an ultrasound, and he had to do an MRI with contrast, and, man, were we scared, but, um …
Jim: Hmm.
Janel: … it ended up being that my son had a … I’ll give you a spoiler alert. He had an extra bone in his neck, um-
Jim: Wow.
Janel: And he has named it Eve since, uh-
Jim: Eve?
Janel: Eve, yes.
Jim: (laughs)
Janel: But, at that point, I mean, we had already been planning surgery and everything. There were a lot of things that were, um, were just very scary-
Jim: Yeah.
Janel: … for our family, but, um, there are these moments, sitting with my son, our faces so close, my husband too, we couldn’t tell whose tears were whose.
Jim: Mm-hmm.
Janel: And he just said, “Mom, what’s the worst case possibility? If I die, I’m gonna be with Jesus.”
Jim: Wow.
Janel: And he said, you know, of our, of our toddler friend, he was like, “You know what? God had a purpose for Henry’s life, and God has a purpose for mine. And he said, “He’s not the kind of person who goes around giving people tumors for fun.” And this is my 13-year-old.
Jim: Hmm.
Janel: And I was floored, because at that point, I was like, “Okay, he may have surpassed me at this point.”
Jim: Yeah.
Janel: You know? Um, and I looked at my son’s life, and I looked at the fact. I was just like, “Where does this come from, this faith like a lion. And I realized that he is my son, he has three learning disorders, um, and that has made life incredibly challenging at different points. Um, and, um, I remember, uh, uh, sitting, uh, at a local donut shop beco- And the, this big deal, because I’m a sugar Nazi at our house, and (laughs), um, he’s holding this, you know, maple-flavored donut, the size of a planet, you know, and, um, and he was crying because he had, they had advanced band tryouts at school, and only three kids could make it out of the four saxophonists, and he was number four, and, um, and he was just saying, “You know, I feel like I have more setbacks than wins.” But at that moment, I mean, I, I realized I had a lot of things that I wanted to do, a lot of options in my car deck as a parent, things like, “Throw that band teacher under the bus, and let him know that he could’ve … Uh, I’m sure she just, you know?
Jim: (laughs) It sounds like a sports dad.
Janel: You know?
Jim: That’s what a sports dad would do.
Janel: That kind of thing.
Jim: That coach-
Janel: You know?
Jim: … doesn’t know what he’s talking about.
Janel: I mean, they … Yeah. They don’t know what they’re talking about, or, you know, um, uh, all these things that I wanted to do, pushing the obstacles out of my son’s way, because I just wanted to stop the pain. But a lot of times, when I wanna stop the pain for my kids, it’s that pain and that, that shaping that God is longing to do in their lives. That’s what I’m pushing out of the way-
Jim: Mm-hmm.
Janel: … for this temporary benefits, kind of like … You know, in the Bible, they call it the Sin of Esau in Hebrews, this idea that Esau came and he had an appetite, and he threw away the birthright that would’ve given his generations after him would’ve reaped the rewards, but he could only think in that moment for what his stomach needed. And it was a profound need. He was hungry. We’ve all been famished, but I have to think beyond the bowl of chili (laughs), so to speak. I have to think about the son that God is creating. And I’ll give you one more example. I just had a, I had a friend of mine whose husband did pass away from, from cancer, and, um, and I remember talking to her mom after her mom came to pick up my friend’s kids, and she said, “I can just still picture my, my daughter running around in footie pajamas.” And I guess my point is we don’t know what God needs to prepare them for in their future. Hopefully, it isn’t a spouse who dies of cancer. But we have to cultivate strength in our kids that last so much longer than the band tryout.
Jim: Mm-hmm. Boy, that’s good stuff, and, uh, great insights. You know, I’m not sure where everybody is at today. You might be that parent that just got that news-
Janel: Mm-hmm.
Jim: … that your child has cancer, and our heart goes out to you. I think the key point here is, uh, we have caring Christian counselors. We would want you to get in touch with those we’ve been able because of the generosity of support from people like you. Uh, we’ve been able to keep a counseling team here for 45 years-
Janel: Mm-hmm.
Jim: … you know, about 20 to 25 counselors who can call you back and talk with you, and, you know, provide resources and support and have prayer certainly, and even referrals to other counselors in your area, who are Christian counselors. So if you need that kind of support, don’t hesitate to get in touch with us. We live and breathe for that opportunity. And down to this wonderful book by Janel Breitenstein, um, it is a great resource for parents, specially, uh, when they’re still forming.
Janel: Mm-hmm.
Jim: That’s when you gotta get there. I’m thinking, “Boy, uh, I really could’ve use this with Trent and Troy.” Uh, we did a okay job, but I think there’s some things we could’ve benefited from out of this great-
John: Mm-hmm.
Jim: … book, Permanent Markers, and we wanna get it into your hands. If you can make a gift to Focus of any amount, we’ll send it to you as our way of saying thank you for being part of the ministry, and you get a great resource in your parenting journey.
John: Mm-hmm. Yeah, stop by focusonthefamily.com/broadcast to connect with the counselor, or to order your copy Permanent Markers. And you can always give us a call, our number is 800, the letter A, and the word, FAMILY. That’s 800-232-6459. Well, join us next time as Heather Avis helps us to be more accepting of people with disabilities or, o-or just different than us.
Heather Avis: And we have opportunities all around us to step in the spaces with people who are different than us in an intentional way. Is it gonna be messy? Of course. Is it gonna be hard? Yes. Is hard bad? No. Not always.
John: On behalf of the entire team, thanks for listening to Focus on the Family with Jim Daly. I’m John Fuller, inviting you back as we once again help you and your family thrive in Christ.
