Focus on the Family with Jim Daly

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Lysa TerKeurst: With Jesus, we are always fully loved, fully accepted, completely held, and always invited in.

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John Fuller: Lysa TerKeurst reflecting on the acceptance that you can find in God. And, you’ll hear more from her on today’s Focus on the Family. Your host is Focus President and author Jim Daly. Thanks for joining us, I’m John Fuller.

Jim Daly: Uh, there’s one thing we want you to hear today, and I know this is true for Lysa as well. Um, God loves you. And, uh, sometimes we lose that perspective because things aren’t going right, relationships aren’t going right. And we get lost in the weeds and we don’t feel the love of God, even though it’s consistent, persistent, ever present. And we are gonna talk about God’s love for us today. Um, you may be in a place where you feel inadequate, you feel beaten down, uh, you know what, we’re here for you. We have a counseling staff who can help you sort through where you’re at in your life, and, uh, maybe what the Lord is trying to say. Um, and it’s available to you. Just give us a call and we’re gonna give you those details in a while. Lysa, let’s not hold back, you are an infamous blogger.

John: (laughs) Infamous.

Jim: How about that infamous? I mean, you have like 2 million, 3 million, 18 million. How many million women are following you today?

Lysa: A few.

Jim: (laughs) No. I mean, it’s a lot.

Lysa: It is.

Jim: Why do you think, uh, there’s that attraction to your words and your, um, expression of your faith? What is drawing particularly women to you?

Lysa: Great question. Um, you know, I think a big part of it is I’m very vulnerable with the brokenness of life. Just the reality is we’re all broken people and, uh, people can identify with someone’s brokenness. So, when I write from that perspective, everybody can identify with hurts and, failures, and shortcomings, inadequacies. Everybody can identify that. Not everybody can identify from your point of strength, you know. So, I don’t write for my point of strength. Um, I write from my point of failure, weakness, hurts, heartbreaks. And certainly, with this book writing from my own struggle with rejection. So, if you wanna know what I struggle with, you can look at the titles of my books.

Jim: (laughs) Well, this one is Uninvited–

Lysa: (laughs) Yes.

Jim: … which is not a warm title. What were you expressing there? What are you trying to get across in Uninvited?

Lysa: Well, I think in today’s social media driven world, where so many of our relationships have some kind of presence on social media. I think a lot of us are walking around, having looked at social media first thing in the morning and getting this feeling of being a little bit left out, a little bit lonely, a little bit less than. It seems like everybody’s house is a little better decorated than yours. Everybody else’s marriage is a little more romantic than yours. Everybody else’s kids are more put together and successful than yours. And so, it can sort of develop within us this feeling of extreme inadequacy, not something we talk about publicly, but something we certainly deal with privately. So, the point of titling the book Uninvited is, um, that’s really the essence of what rejection is.

Jim: It’s what it feels like.

Lysa: It, it’s what it feels like. And so, um, but here’s the hope of the book, is that when someone finishes reading Uninvited, I’m gonna encourage them to get a black Sharpie marker and cross-

Jim: (laughs).

Lysa: … out the UN in the book title so then they will understand that with Jesus, we are always fully loved, fully accepted, completely held and always invited in.

Jim: That’s a great point. Uh, let me ask you this, social media seems to be your forte. You’re a speaker and author, but social media, you’re communicating every day with literally millions of people. And that’s outstanding. I read something about the loneliness index. It came out a c- a couple of months ago, but it said basically, uh, the loneliness index has gone up 20% over the last couple of years. So, even though we’re more connected digitally, we have communication occurring. It seems people are m- more lonely than they used to be. How come that’s happening?

Lysa: Well, I think there’s several reasons for that. But one thing is the ability to filter the hardship of life out of our social media. You know, uh, think about it this way.

Jim: It’s only the best stuff you see (laughs).

Lysa: It’s only the best stuff from everybody else’s life that you see. And so, when you start feeling like everybody else is more than, and you are less than, you start to pull away from deep heartfelt connections with other people. That creates loneliness. You know, you don’t have to be alone to be lonely. My loneliest times sometimes are when I’m in a room full of people, and everyone is talking, but there’s some sense deep inside of me that I don’t belong or that I’m not part of whatever club they’re part of, or I’m, I don’t have the same inside jokes as everyone else. And the worst feeling to me is when you’re alone in a crowded room.

Jim: Well, you, in fact, uh, there was a story in the book that I found funny, really, it’s where you went to a dinner banquet-

Lysa: (laughs).

Jim: … and you ended up at a table by yourself (laughs) that had to-

Lysa: Yes.

Jim: … feel really weird.

Lysa: Uh, well, it’s awkward.

Jim: (laughs).

Lysa: I mean, let’s just-

Jim: Why were you by yourself at a big table?

Lysa: Okay. Uh, that is such a great question.

Jim: (laughs).

Lysa: Uh, so what happened is I walked into the dinner, and I was so excited because-

Jim: So, it’s a banquet.

Lysa: It’s a banquet, a full of leaders. So, I fully expected to go, these are my people. Like, I’m gonna be able to sit, we’re gonna swap stories. We’re gonna talk heart-to-heart. We’re gonna share our challenges, our successes, our failures, like this is gonna be awesome. I crave time with people who are living the same kind of life as I am. So, I was really excited about this banquet. I walked in and I walked to a table where a bunch of people I knew were sitting and there were nameplates. So, you know, just place cards, where everybody is supposed to sit where you’re assigned. So, I walked around that table and my name card wasn’t there. I walked around another table, another table. And finally in the back of the room, I finally found my name. Now, that’s awkward in and of itself. When you’re walking around, you can’t find.

John: You spent a lot of time looking.

Lysa: Yes, where you’re supposed to sit. So, I sit down, and I didn’t recognize the other people who were assigned to my table. And I don’t know what happened to them. It’s just, they didn’t show up. And so, the banquet starts and there I sit at a table meant for 10 people, and I’m the only person. And I guess other people didn’t really feel the freedom to get up and come and sit with me because we had assigned seats.

Jim: Ah.

Lysa: And so there I sat at a table-

Jim: (laughs).

Lysa: … all by myself.

Jim: Yeah.

Lysa: And so, I had a choice to make when I was sitting there. And of course, I felt awkward. I felt, uh, you can just imagine like, how you would feel, you know. Of course, I had a basket of 10 rolls, so I’m like-

John: (laughs)

Jim: That was a happy side of that-

Lysa: That was the happy s- uh, that was a happy side ’cause I don’t have to share the rolls with anybody. Oh, and desserts were already laid out too.

Jim: Oh, perfect.

Lysa: So, it’s like, but I, I really challenged myself. I said, okay, Lysa, you can sit here and try to fill this emptiness with all the extra rolls and desserts-

Jim: (laughs).

Lysa: … and, and having a little pity party for yourself. Or you can decide to see this as a time where the Lord himself wants to be right here beside you. And if you were distracted in conversation with nine other people sitting at your table, you wouldn’t be so desperate to have a conversation with the Lord. So, it’s your choice. You know, you can look at this as being set aside, or you can choose to see it as God’s opportunity to set you apart.

Jim: Ah.

Lysa: And so, it really wasn’t about me surviving the banquet. It was about me developing a mindset. Lysa, there are always gonna be moments like this in your life, you know, and you have to make the choice-

Jim: Yeah.

Lysa: … to understand that God has your best interest in mind.

Jim: Let me ask you this because sometimes, um, and I don’t mean to step on anybody’s toes. But sometimes we can be overly sensitive. I mean, that could actually break somebody emotionally.

Lysa: Mm-hmm.

Jim: They, you overplay it. In other words, nobody wants to come sit with me. Nobody wants to talk to me. Um, you might be a mom at a park and a play day, and you’re at the bench and there’s other moms there, but nobody’s approaching you. Um, how does a person rise above that kind of negative self-talk and get into a better place where, you know, just relax. It’s not, it’s not about you (laughs).

Lysa: Well, first of all, I wanna normalize the negative self-talk. We all do it. It’s not-

Jim: What does it sound like?

Lysa: It, well, for me, I don’t know what it sounds like in your head-

Jim: (laughs).

Lysa: … but in my, it sounds like, of course, you know, of course you’re alone. You’re always alone. Of course, no one wants to talk to you because, you know, you, you talk too much at the table or you’re, uh, you know, this is just the theme of your life, Lysa. You know, your dad didn’t want you, uh, that boyfriend in college didn’t want you, so why would it be any different today? You know-

Jim: Wow. That’s big stuff.

Lysa: It is big stuff.

Jim: It not small.

Lysa: But I wanna say, it, may be your dialogue is different, but everyone has this. Everyone has in the core of who they are, uh, this feeling of, do I really measure up? Do I really have what it takes? All of us ask that question. Now, we’re not typically in day-to-day conversation that vulnerable with one another, but we all have that. And so, first of all, I wanna say, if you have that negative self-talk, don’t beat yourself up for having it. It’s normal.

John: Hmm.

Lysa: But here’s how you overcome it, is making the decision that it’s not your circumstances that determine whether or not you’re worthy.

Jim: Amen.

Lysa: It is the truth of who God says you are. And God says you are valuable. You are wanted. You know, before we were even here, just the very thought of us made God explode with extreme joy and say, yes, the thought of Jim Daly, that’s a very good thought. So-

Jim: (laughs) That doesn’t feel comfortable, actually, but, uh-

Lysa: So, he allowed you to be-

Jim: Yeah.

Lysa: … here out of the millions of combinations of all the cells that had to come together to create you. God made sure that he formed you. The very thought of you made his heart exploded with joy. And so, you know, not to over spiritualize it, but, but I have to say to myself, instead of looking at this moment as something to feed that negative self-talk, I’ve gotta look at this moment as my opportunity to bring the fullness of God into the space that I’m walking in. So, that night I had a choice. I could sit there and say, woe is me, no one wants me. Or I could say, you know what, there are about 99% of other people here, whether they’re seated alone or seated at a table with other people who also have the same struggles.

Jim: Hmm.

Lysa: So, I’m gonna walk into this room and I’m gonna bring the love of God with me. I’m gonna bring the acceptance. I’m gonna look around the room, I’m gonna find somebody who I discern needs an encouraging word. I’m gonna get my butt up off my chair and I’m gonna walk over to that person. Even if they’re at a table with 10 people, I’m gonna walk up to them. I want to go, you know what, I was just sitting here, and I was looking around the room, had some extra time to really focus on other people. And I noticed you. And I just wanna-

Jim: Ah.

Lysa: … say, I don’t know what you’re going through right now-

Jim: Yeah.

Lysa: … but God made sure to send a message from me to you to say he loves you. He’s crazy about you.

Jim: You know that’s so good because when I’ve done that, um, it makes me feel better too.

Lysa: It does.

Jim: Just noticing others. It is the love God in our heart. So often though, we suppress it with more of our fleshly attitude of being down in the dumps. Another funny story you had, which I totally related to was (laughs) when you left your briefcase or a suitcase outside-

Lysa: Yes.

Jim: … a car, and you started just beating yourself up. I think I had that exact same conversation to myself but describe it.

Lysa: So, I had been speaking at a conference and, uh, it was one where, when the car pulled up to take me to the airport, there was lots of chaos. I was either on my cell phone or I was in a conversation with someone. I’m not sure why I was distracted, but I hopped in the car. And I assumed that the driver had put my luggage in the back of my car. And I shouldn’t have made that assumption, I should’ve checked, but I didn’t. So, we get all the way 30 minutes away from the venue where I was at. We pull up, I hop out, I asked him to pop the back trunk and he says why? And I said, oh, I w- I gotta get my luggage out. And he was like, there’s no luggage (laughs) in the back.

Jim: You’re like, what? (laughs)

Lysa: So, there I’m at the airport, and I have no luggage. And so, I quickly call someone on my cell phone that was still at the venue, can you please send someone over here to get my luggage? But I recognize that my timing was very short. So, there was a great chance I was gonna miss my flight if they didn’t really go fast and get my luggage there quickly. So, I’m standing on the sidewalk outside of the airport and I’m speaking to myself. And I’m just saying oh-

Jim: Out loud.

Lysa: Out loud. I’m like, ah, Lysa, you’re such an idiot. You know, why don’t you pay attention?

Jim: (laughs).

Lysa: I mean, you’re always doing stuff like this. So, I’m saying all of this.

Jim: Oh.

Lysa: And all of a sudden, one of the guys who’s working at the outside check-in counter for an airline, he walks up to me, and he puts his hand up and he says, absolutely not. And, uh, it shocked me so much (laughs).

Jim: A stranger.

Lysa: A stranger. He said, absolutely not. I said, excuse me. He said, “Absolutely not. I will not allow you to talk about yourself in that way. Not in my presence.

Jim: Wow.

Lysa: Not in my presence.” And I thought-

Jim: It was like a God figure.

Lysa: I thought, are you an angel? And then he said a cuss word. And I thought-

Jim: No (laughs).

Lysa: Okay, he’s probably not an angel. Or it would be my-

Jim: But he had a good heart.

Lysa: … like I have a cussing angel (laughing).

Jim: He was trying to say to you stop it.

Lysa: But he had such a good heart. And, you know, it really wasn’t the luggage guy at the airport that was saying those words to me.

Jim: Hmm.

Lysa: It was really, I feel like a message from God himself saying, Lysa, not in my presence will you talk about yourself this way. You see, every day we have a choice. We can bring the fullness of ourself, which is insecurities and we can let our insecurities be the first thing that walks into any situation. Or we can bring the fullness of God who brings with him all security, who, who brings, we, like, if we walk into a room bringing the fullness of God, we’re freed up to see and love other people.

Jim: Hmm.

John: Lysa TerKeurst is our guest on Focus on the Family, and, and she’s sharing some great insights. And the conversation today is based on her book, Uninvited: Living Loved When You Feel Less Than, Left Out, and Lonely. We’ve got that available at focusonthefamily.com/broadcast, or when you call 800, the letter A, and the word FAMILY. And we’ll send that book out to you when you make a generous donation of any amount to this ministry today. And let’s go ahead and hear more now from Lysa TerKeurst as she discussed how to not beat up ourselves, even when we make mistakes. And Lysa, I’m identifying with you because just a couple of weeks ago, I got all the way through security. I got to my gate, and I realized I left my laptop on a conference room table at a hotel.

Lysa: Hmm.

John: And it’s so easy to beat myself up for that. Um, where in scripture are you seeing that God doesn’t join me in beating me up for that kind of stupidity or forgetfulness? I mean, there’s, there’s encouragement in the scripture-

Jim: Or how about for your 13-year-old? (laughing)

Lysa: Absolutely. Absolutely. Well, I think the entirety of God’s message to us in scripture. One of my favorite places to turn though is Psalms where, you know, we are reassured over and over and over. Uh, many of the Psalms were written by David who happens to be very featured in my book, Uninvited. Because if you look at one of the first stories we ever hear about David, it’s when his father Jesse was asked by the prophet Samuel to invite all of his sons to come and stand before him. And from his sons, from his group of family that, uh, Samuel would anoint the next king. And Jesse invited in all of his sons except David. So, when David pens so many of the Psalms, he’s so brutally honest in how he feels about his circumstance, but he calls things to mind. And one of the biggest things that he calls to mind is not the projections of his past, but the love of God who is very, very present.

Jim: Mm-hmm.

Lysa: So, for me, a lot of times when I’m feeling those desperate feelings of being rejected or being left out or feeling lonely, I open up the Psalms, especially the ones penned by David. And I let the reality of his honesty seep deep into my heart, and watch how he turns from feeling rejected, to feeling completely loved and accepted by God.

Jim: Uh, Lysa, let me ask you this, uh, that self-rejection occurs, and you’ve described that adequately in the, in the way we beat ourselves up with negative self-talk. There’s also the rejection from another person that’s real.

Lysa: Mm-hmm.

Jim: You know, the friend that used to be a friend, but for some reason they don’t return the calls anymore, whatever it might be. How do you counsel a person to manage that when it’s real, it’s formidable and there’s something that you’ve, that has pushed somebody away and you don’t even know what it is maybe?

Lysa: Right. Well, I wrote in the book, rejection steals the best of who I am by reinforcing the worst that’s been said to me. So, what often happens is when someone has given you a line of rejection, so they have said to you, Jim, um, you’re not cool enough to be my friend. Or a girl in high school maybe said to you one time, the famous line, like, Jim, I think you’re amazing. You’re just not amazing for me

Jim: (laughs) How’d you know that happened (laughing).

Lysa: ‘Cause it’s happened to so many of us, right?

Jim: Wow.

Lysa: Or, uh, whatever, you know. I mean, I, I once had a guy in high school who I was just crazy about, say, Lysa, you’re a great friend, but I can’t ever imagine you really being my girlfriend.

Jim: And you liked the guy.

Lysa: Yeah. And I liked him.

Jim: Yes. Hmm.

Lysa: And so, at the core of all of that is basically someone else saying, you’re not good enough for me. Okay. So, that is a line, L-I-N-E. That’s a statement that they made, a line that they spoke into your life. Well, what happens is that line then eventually in your life, if it sinks in and often those lines of rejection goes straight to the core of who we are. It’s more than an emotion we feel in the moment. It becomes something that goes from a line or a statement that they said, to a lie we start to believe about ourselves. Then that lie that we believe about ourselves becomes a liability in every other relationship that we’re in, including our relationship with God. So, I imagine, okay, let’s just not to pick on you, Jim, but let’s say-

Jim: (laughs).

Lysa: … that girl said that to you in high school. Okay. And then here we are, how many ever years after high school, you’re like 10 years out of high school, something like that, right?

Jim: Oh yeah. Yeah, right around there (laughing). Right around the 10-

Lysa: But (laughs)-

Jim: … times three, four.

Lysa: Okay. So, 30, 40 years out of high school. I didn’t wanna say it, but you did. So, here we go. So, it’s been a long time, right? But somewhere, if you let that statement that that girl in high school made, seat down into your heart and become the liability of you believing about yourself, you’re not quite good enough. Then that feeling of rejection is gonna be compounded every other time someone says something to you, and you don’t feel good enough.

Jim: Yeah.

Lysa: Rejection, undealt with rejection, will multiply the feelings so that you have a disproportionate response to something that someone said that tapped into that same feeling, you’re not good enough.

Jim: Right. And you’re talking from experience because you touched on it a moment ago, but you mentioned, uh, your, you know, tough relationship with your father.

Lysa: Mm-hmm.

Jim: Describe that and how that set you on a certain path.

Lysa: Well, my dad had his own issues of brokenness and, you know, I can look back now and see that. But as a child, I didn’t understand that it had w- his lack of love for me, I didn’t understand as a child, it had a lot more to do with him, a lot less to do wi- uh, with me. But-

Jim: Describe the, the environment so we can catch it.

Lysa: Okay.

Jim: ‘Cause a lot of people will share that environment with you.

Lysa: Right. So, one of my earliest memories of my dad is being about eight years old. And, um, my mom had gotten me a new dress for Easter. I put it on, and it was rare for us to have money to buy a store-bought dress, so it was really special to me. So, I put this dress on and I felt so pretty. And I thought, I think that tonight is the night that my daddy will actually notice me.

Jim: Hmm.

Lysa: So, I walked out-

Jim: You remember that?

Lysa: Oh, I remember it vividly.

Jim: Wow.

Lysa: I walk out into the den. My dad was sitting in a recliner chair. He had a beer in one hand, he had a TV remote in his other hand, he was watching something on the TV. And I went and stood beside his chair. And my heart was just beating so fast like, daddy, please notice me, daddy, tell me I’m beautiful. Daddy tell me that you love me. And he never looked my way. So, I did what any little girl would do to try to get attention in that moment, I started to twirl around and around and around. And as my dress was flowing out, my heart was just crying out. Daddy, please look at me.

Jim: Wow.

Jim: Wow.

Lysa: And, um, he never looked at me. He never said anything that night. It didn’t matter how many times I twirled around. You see, he was present physically, but he was absent emotionally.

Jim: Right.

Lysa: And to a little girl, when a man is physically present but emotionally absent, it creates a deep hollow feeling inside of her heart.

Jim: Wow.

Lysa: That creates almost this desperate feeling of, I’ve got to find someone to tell me that I’m beautiful, that I’m noticed, and that I’m loved. And so, for me, it set me on this path where I was so desperate to hear those words from a man, since I never heard them from my dad, that it kind of put me in this place of, of grabbing for scraps of love from other people.

Jim: Ah.

Lysa: And, um, and we, if we don’t grasp the love of God in that hollow feeling, then we will always grab at scraps of love from other people. And that’s-

Jim: Wow. And they’re never satisfying.

Lysa: Never satisfying.

Jim: Lysa, can I, um, press you a little bit in an area that some people might be thinking, and it may be temperament. I’m not even sure. But, um, can we really blame it just on our environment and our circumstances? Um, can you be a little tougher? I don’t want to sound mean-spirited, but some people who may not have that sensitivity, don’t even understand it. And I think for a large part, males are less oriented to really grabbing the impact of what happens in childhood. Those things that you don’t get emotionally, spiritually, the love that you don’t feel.

Lysa: Hmm.

Jim: Uh, we don’t have as much capacity, I think. And I’m being very generic to understand it. I think women feel it far deeper and get it far better than men. And that may be why it has such a long impact on a little girl who becomes a woman-

Lysa: Mm-hmm.

Jim: … who’s looking for those scraps as you described it.

Lysa: Yeah. And I would say that, uh, the gift to a woman who feels the pain a little bit deeper is when we feel the pain, we are much more motivated to heal the pain. You see, I think guys feel the pain too. It’s just that we’re, I don’t think-

Jim: We mask it or?

Lysa: Yeah. I think that guys can, um, fill it up temporarily with success, with performance, with, um, surface relationships, but there will come a time in your life-

Jim: Hmm.

Lysa: … uh, for every man where if you ever hear from your wife, I really wish you would be more tender with me. And I think a lot of guys hear this from their wife. What they’re really, really, what the wife is really saying is, I wish you would open up the deep places of your heart to me. I wish you would bring your brokenness and vulnerability. Like, if your wife ever says that to you, Jim, then what she’s really saying is, Jim, you’ve got a broken place deep down in your heart, and I wish you would come to me and say, I’m afraid. I wish you would come to me and say, I’m heartbroken over something. I wish you would come to me and bring those vulnerable parts of your heart. Because I believe that every person, male or female, experiences rejection as a little person and wrestles with it, the rest of their life.

Jim: Hmm.

Lysa: And if we don’t allow those deep recesses of our heart to be open to the healing of God, then we’re gonna create surface relationships that don’t ever get to that deep heart center place. And every woman longs for her husband to get there.

Jim: Yeah. Um, Lysa, that is such profound and deep stuff you’re talking about. And we are at the end of the program and, uh, we’re going continue the conversation. But if this has touched your heart, um, Lysa has shared so openly about her own past, her own vulnerabilities, and maybe that’s triggered, uh, something in you and you, uh, need someone to talk to. If that’s the case, uh, we have caring Christian counselors who are here. Um, sometimes, uh, the call volume is high. Leave a message and they will get back to you. Don’t sit in isolation. Uh, there’s nothing you’re gonna share with us that we haven’t heard. It’s rare because we’ve been at it for almost 40 years, and these folks know what they’re talking about. And I hope you will contact us and allow us to put a resource in your hand, might be Lysa’s book. It may be other resources too. But we want you to call us if you’re struggling with rejection and loneliness, and you feel uninvited.

John: And that phone consultation begins, uh, with a call to 800-A-FAMILY. 800, the letter A, and the word FAMILY.

Jim: Uh, Lysa, I obviously want to say thanks for being here today, but I’m gonna give you overnight to think about this question starting tomorrow. And we’re gonna start right here. And that is, given all the pain, given the rejection, why does God allow us to go through this? What is the purpose? So, you think about it, and we’ll start the program with your answer next time. Can we, do it?

Lysa: Sounds good. Yes.

Jim: Okay.

John: And we’d encourage you to get that book by Lysa TerKeurst. Um, it can be yours when you make a donation of any amount to the ministry here of Focus on the Family. Uh, that book is called Uninvited: Living Loved When You Feel Less Than, Left Out, and Lonely. And will help you live out some of the principles that, uh, Lysa has been sharing today. So, donate and get your copy of that book when you visit focusonthefamily.com/broadcast. On behalf of Jim Daly and the entire team, thanks for joining us today for Focus on the Family. I’m John Fuller, inviting you back as we once again, help you and your family thrive in Christ.