Focus on the Family with Jim Daly

Jay Laffoon: If Christ is in you and Christ is in your spouse, the way you speak to your spouse, is the way you speak to Christ. And that is mind-blowing. And I, I’d never really comprehended that until I realized that Jesus is living in her.

John Fuller: Well, that’s Jay and Laura Laffoon, sharing ways that you can find more joy in your marriage. Thanks for joining us for Focus on the Family with Jim Daly. I’m John Fuller.

Jim Daly: You know, John, we often talk about overcoming challenges in our marriages. That’s pretty typical here at Focus on the Family. But marriage can be fun too. That is the goal. And I wanna encourage you to not let the busyness of life, uh, kinda stop you from finding moments of joy. That is part of what marriage should be about. Uh, Jean and I love to laugh. I feel closest to Jean when she is laughing.

John: Hmm.

Jim: I mean, I… That’s… Humor is my thing. And so, when she’s laughing, I know we’re in a good place. Uh, but today, we wanna talk about some practical, realistic tips to build a marriage that doesn’t just survive but thrives.

John: Yeah, it has-

Jim: And that’s a good thing.

John: … has joyful moments. And Jay and Laura Laffoon are, uh, descri- self-described marriage-

Jim: (laughs)

John: … edutainers or something like that. You’ll have to tell us more. They, uh, entertain and educate couples to strengthen marriage and they have a devotional book that we’re, uh, talking about. It’s called Celebrate Your Marriage: 365 Daily Devotions for Busy Couples. Find out about our guests and this great resource. We’ve got details at focusonthefamily.com/broadcast.

Jim: Jay and Laura, welcome back to Focus on the Family.

Jay: Great to be here.

Laura Laffoon: Great to be here.

Jim: It’s been a while.

Jay: It has.

Jim: I think ’08.

Jay: It was-

Jim: Yeah, we took a look at the records-

Jay: Yes.

Jim: … and saw that you were here in ’08.

Jay: Yes.

Jim: So it’s good to have you back. Let’s start with the basics. How long have you two been married?

Laura: Well, coming up this December, it’ll be 40 years.

Jim: All right, that’s a big milestone.

John: Congrats.

Laura: It is a big milestone.

Jim: Not quite the big 50.

Laura: No, I’m not-

Jay: We were set up on a blind date.

Laura: … that old, so I don’t know why it’s 40.

Jim: Set up on a blind date?

Jay: Yes-

Laura: (laughs).

Jay: We were-

Jim: That was my wife’s greatest fear.

Group: (laughter).

Jay: Well-

Jim: And we were a blind date-

Jay: Oh.

Jim: … the two of us.

Jay: Were you really? That’s funny.

Jim: Yes. (laughs)

Jay: Well, the next morning, she told her mom she was gonna marry me.

Jim: Really?

Jay: And, uh, 10 days later, I asked her.

Jim: Wow.

Jay: Yeah.

John: That’s pretty fast.

Jim: Okay, that’s a little fast. Most everybody went, “Okay, that couldn’t-”

Laura: (laughs).

Jim: “… have been right.”

Jay: And the- the strange part, we wer- we were living in Atlanta, Georgia at the time. Two million people. And Laura managed for her path and my path to cross eight of the next… Of those 10 days.

Jim: (laughs).

Jay: And I didn’t know it then, but we have a word for that now, it’s called stalking.

Jim: (laughs).

John: (laughs).

Jay: … And so, uh, (laughs) yeah…

Jim: Boy, he’s really painting a picture.

Jay: (laughs).

Jim: Do you-

Laura: Yeah.

Jim: Let me ask this counseling question.

Laura: Uh-huh (laughs).

Jim: Do you agree with his representation?

Laura: Um, I don’t like that word, stalking, but, yeah-

Jay: (laughs).

Laura: … sure. I did manage to make it all happen (laughs).

Jay: Yes, okay (laughs), she orchestrated it, that’s for sure.

Jim: Okay. So, I’m not… This is in jest. So how many of those years were happy years? No, I’m kidding (laughs).

Jay: No.

Laura: (laughs).

Jim: (laughs).

Jay: It’s been amazing. Um… we do like to laugh. That’s- that’s one of the things that brought us together.

Jim: But let me ask about that.

Jay: Mm-hmm.

Jim: Does temperament play a role in that? I’m serious, you know, I’m thinking and, again, not to stereotype, but, uh, you know, the engineer, the accountant, people that, you know, laughter… It’s just, they- they do think frivolity isn’t as healthy as being serious and solving a problem. But-

Laura: Oh, for sure.

Jim: So does temperament play into this a bit?

Laura: Uh, absolutely. Because we run into couples all the time. Because we are… I mean, our ministry is called Celebrate Ministries, our conferences are called Celebrate Your Marriage, so we’re all about the celebration. And we run into couples all the time who are like, “Jay and Laura, you guys just seem to be naturally funny.”

Jay: (laughs).

Laura: “What can we do? I mean, we’re not funny people. So what- what… How can we bring joy?” And that is one of the things that we, you know, we really pound into them, for lack of a better word, is, you know, find some things that you enjoy. It doesn’t mean you have to laugh all the time. It doesn’t have to mean you tell silly dad jokes. And I think-

Jay: Yeah.

Laura: … when you’re enjoying each other, the laughter’s gonna come naturally. So, for those people who may say, you know, “We’re not funny people,” you know, “I think that’s just frivolous,” well, then, find things that you enjoy doing together, and then the joy’ll come.

Jay: We were, uh, doing a seminar in West Michigan. And for those, uh, people that don’t know West Michigan, it’s very Dutch.

Jim: Yes.

Jay: And very reserved.

Jim: Holland, Grand Rapids.

Jay: Yup. You know, it was just like, no one was laughing. Uh, and, and that’s fine. But afterward, we had couple after couple say, “That was the- the funniest thing we’ve ever experienced.”

Jim: But you never heard-

Jay: But-

Jim: … it from the audience.

Laura: (laughs).

Jay: No. And- and so then, you know, those different personality temperaments (laughs), it’s fine and- and we- we get it, but the scripture is clear. “The joy of the Lord is my strength.” So however you need to work in joy into your life, let’s do that.

Jim: Okay. We’ve covered that one, I think we’ve got it. Laura, what are some other things? This could be the end of the program, just five minutes in.

Laura: (laughs).

Jay: (laughs).

Jim: I mean, what, (laughing), what does it take to have a happy marriage beyond the humor and seeking those fun times?

Laura: Well, I think it takes intentionality. It takes time. It takes honoring each other, respecting each other.

Jay: Patience.

Laura: Um, patie-

Jim: (laughs).

Laura: Uh, I, I, I don’t like to say-

Jim: Oh.

Laura: … that word ’cause then you get-

Jim: What word do you like?

Laura: … tested on patience (laughs).

Jim: (laughs) Oh, oh.

Laura: I grew up here, don’t say patient. Don’t pray for patience (laughs).

Jim: So the Lord still may be polishing your patience a little?

Laura: Exactly (laughs).

Jay: Oh, there’s no question.

Laura: Exactly.

Jim: (laughs).

Laura: And I think being intentional about enjoying each other. We tell couples all the time, one of our big practical tools that we try and get people to build into their daily life is 15 minutes of uninterrupted conversation.

Jim: That’s good.

Laura: Um, you know, if you have young children, putting them in front of a TV show for 15 minutes isn’t gonna hurt them. Um, and when-

Jim: 15 hours might be a problem.

Jay: (laughs).

John: Yes.

Laura: Yeah, that would be different, you know, or wait ’til they go to bed, or do it before they wake up. But having that constant uninterrupted conversation with each other really helps with the joy, with the laughter, with the communication.

Jay: During the hard times.

Laura: Yeah, with all of the things that marriage seem… You know, that life seems to throw at your marriage. When you can take that 15 minutes every day and say, “Hey, how was your day?” catching up with each other, having that time with each other.

Jim: Laura, let me ask you this, uh, as the wife. Um, sometimes I have the impression that wives are looking for the big moment, and that’s what makes a difference, something profound. And, you know, Jean and I will often have a conversation about the many little things that are getting done here.

Laura: Mm-hmm.

Jim: Like, getting up together, praying together in the morning, spending morning time together. Jean and I have really s- through COVID… COVID, with all of its negative and downside, the positive for us was we did spend mornings connecting with each other, ’cause I didn’t have to rush off to meetings. But speak to that, um, the diligence of doing so many little things well…

John: Hmm.

Jim: … versus, you know, the, uh, uh, uh, the once-in-a-while big thing being done well. And, and what do you think is most important? What should we be concentrating on?

Laura: You know, I think- I think you’re right that most women look for those big moments. They’re looking for their husband to make this big, grand gesture. And I always-

Jim: The two dozen red roses.

Laura: Yeah. Bring, you know…

Jim: Boom.

Jay: Two?

Jim: (laughs).

Laura: (laughs).

Jay: Three.

Jim: Okay, sorry. See, I already made a mistake.

Jay: Holy, holy, holy, you gotta do a three.

Group: (laughter).

Laura: And I always tell women, “It’s not rocket science. And you shouldn’t be looking for those.” Look for those little things every day that he does that tells you that you are the most important person in his life. I’ll give you this example. We are coffee drinkers. And I’m- (laughs).

Jim: (laughs).

Laura: And so, when we get up in the morning, we both… I mean, it’s like you just gravitate to the coffee. I can’t do anything else without the coffee. But when w- our kids were in the house and I was up first getting the children up, I would come downstairs, get everything ready, I’d have my first cup of coffee. By the time Jay got downstairs, my coffee cup was empty.

Jay: Because she told me to stay in bed-

Laura: (laughs).

Jay: … and make sure the kids got dressed. And…

Jim: (laughs).

Laura: But what he would do… It would’ve been very easy, very natural, very human for him to come downstairs, go right into the kitchen, fill up his coffee cup, and then come in to get my empty one. But he, every morning, got up, came downstairs, would get my empty cup, fill it up, then go back and get his second cup of coffee.

Jim: Aww.

Laura: Again, that’s not rocket science.

Jim: But that’s- but that is kinda what I’m talking about.

Laura: But it’s a little thing.

Jim: Those things, yeah.

Laura: Yeah, it’s those, it’s those little things. I don’t fill my own gas tank. That’s not…

Jim: Hey, hey, hey-

Laura: Again-

Jim: … wait a minute.

Laura: (laughs).

John: Oh, the bar-

Jim: I’m not around Jean at all when she’s at a gas station, so…

John: The bar just rose a little bit now. Yeah, yeah.

Laura: It’s just those little things that you need to look for that your husband does that says-

Jim: Yeah.

Laura: … he loves you.

Jay: I was challenged by a good friend to, every two or three years, introduce something new into the relationship that is subtle but important. And for 25, 30 years of our life, Laura made the bed in the morning. And I thought, “I’ll start making the bed. Wouldn’t that be a nice little gesture? It’s not a big thing.”

Jim: Well, it depends on how well you make it.

Jay: There’s the rub.

John: Oh (laughs).

Laura: Exactly (laughs).

Jim: (laughs) Yeah. Okay, I was already mid-sentence.

Laura: Exactly.

Jim: Cause I’m, like, throwing the covers together.

John: (laughs).

Jay: You know, I- I was informed that I was doing the pillows wrong.

Jim: Yeah.

Laura: (laughs).

Jay: And then I’m like, “Well, if we didn’t have 18 pillows…”

Jim: You put the open side to the outside, right?

Laura: (laughs).

Jay: Exactly.

Jim: They go to the inside, bud.

Jay: Inside, that’s right, inside. But-

Jim: The open end, you put it to the inside.

Jay: One of the things that we always do at our conferences-

Laura: At least we’re all clear and we know how to-

Jay: Yeah.

Laura: … make the bed correctly.

Jim: Which way do you put toilet paper on the roll?

John: We’ll put some charts-

Jay: It’s gotta come over the top.

Jim: Over the top.

Laura: (laughs).

Jay: Over the top.

Jim: You are well-trained.

Jay: That’s right. And- and the real monsters in the room are the ones that just put it on the sink.

Jim: (laughs).

Jay: (laughs). They just take the-

Jim: That’s what our four-year-old does.

Laura: (laughs).

Jay: Exactly.

Laura: (laughs).

Jim: Um, le- speak to the importance of date night. That’s something… You know, Greg and Erin Smalley here, they run our marriage area and do a fantastic job with that. But that’s something they really concentrate on and repeat over and over the importance of spending regular time together, whether that’s a- a weekly date night, whatever it might be. I think for Jean and I, that’s been hard to do because we’re on the move so much. And so much of what we do is fun. I mean, we’re with donors, we’re out, uh, doing things with people that are very interesting. But it’s not a date night. And it- it’s hard for me to confess… I mean, it’s hard for me to have that discipline. But it’s really important.

Jay: We were doing… We have a- a- a… Part of our program is called the Ultimate Date Night. We travel the churches and do, uh, 90-minutes of music, comedy, and biblical truth. And we were in some small town in Ohio, and this elderly gentleman came up to me, and he said, “Remind the youngsters, ‘What you did to get her is what you need to do to keep her.’”

Jim: (laughs).

Jay: Well, what’d you do to get her?

Jim: Yeah.

Jay: You took her on dates.

Jim: Talk, talk, talk.

Jay: Yeah, you made her fee- you made her feel special.

Jim: Mm-hmm.

Jay: And that dating every day… Uh, not every day, every week, hopefully, if not, every month, is something that reinforces, “No, you are my commitment. I… You are important to me.” One of the times, uh… We always try and give our- our couples a challenge at our conferences. And one year, we did a little challenge coin that said the words, “Just because” on it. And the concept was, “I’m gonna do something for Laura just because. No other expectations.” And then I give her the coin and then the same back and forth. And sometimes a little surprise date is one of those just because moments, where, you know, “Honey, guess what? I’ve cleared your schedule, I’ve cleared my schedule, and we’re gonna go for the afternoon antiquing,” or whatever it is that she might wanna do.

Jim: Oh, my (laughs).

Jay: Yeah.

Jim: (laughs).

Laura: (laughs).

Jay: Sorry.

Jim: What a sacrifice.

Jay: (laughs).

Laura: (laughs). I do think, though, lots of couples… “What do we do for a date?” I mean-

Jim: Yeah.

Laura: … how many times can you go to dinner and a movie? How many times… So I think just being creative. And one… A- again, one of the things we encourage couples to do is sit down and make a list of the things that you would like to do on a date, and then have your wife, Jean, make a list of what she would like to do on a date. Then you look at those and you combine them, the best you can-

Jim: Yeah.

Laura: … and take it right then and put it on the calendar.

Jim: Yeah, that’s good.

Laura: Then you have it.

Jay: Antiquing is fun, actually. I was-

Laura: Yeah.

Jim: Not- not really.

Jay: … playing around with that.

Laura: (laughs).

Jim: But clothes shopping-

Jay: Oh yeah.

Jim: …Oh my. Now, I did learn a little secret see, so I am a- a hunter when I shop.

John: (laughs).

Jim: I do not like lingering. I like to go, you know, BOOM! Get the animal and get out of there. So Jean and I were up in a ski resort, here in Colorado and she wanted to do a little shopping and so I (laughs) went ahead of her, first time I ever did this, I went ahead of her and worked it out with a salesperson. I said, “Put these four things out, I actually know her colors pretty well.” So I put like three or four outfits out in the store. Next to the store she was in, and then I went down like four rows of stores-

Laura: (laughs).

Jim: … and did this. And these people are like, “This is pretty…” And she came through and she actually ended buying a lot of what I’d picked.

Laura: (laughs).

Jim: … Not everything.

John: So it was an expensive, uh, getaway.

Laura: (laughs).

Jim: Yeah. Yeah. Now my learning is to reduce the number of stores that I do that in. (laughs).

Laura: (laughs).

Jim: To just maybe two or three, not like four or five.

Jay: But what was the price?

Jim: No, it was good though.

Jay: Yeah.

Jim: And it made it… Actually, it made it a lil faster.

Group: (laughs).

Jim: Which was my ultimate goal. I do not want to be in the store for too long, so, that’s kind of funny.

Jay: I can always tell if a- if a women’s clothing store understands it. Because if they understand it, they’ve got chairs for men to sit in.

John: Yeah.

Jim: Some don’t.

Jay: You know, like real comfortable chairs-

Jim: Like, come on.

Jay: … with some magazines there. (laughs).

Laura: (laughs)

Jim: Ridiculous.

Jay: Yeah.

John: Well, this is Focus on the family, with Jim Daly and we have a great time talking with our guests, Jay and Laura Laffoon. And, uh, they’re all about marriage. We are all about helping you and your marriage. And we would recommend their little devotional book, it’s terrific. It’s called, Celebrate Your Marriage: 365 Daily Devotions for Busy Couples. Uh, a lot of great stories and activities in here, uh, and inspiration, of course. Get a copy from us here at the ministry, our number is 800, the letter A, and the word FAMILY, and we’ve got details at focusonthefamily.com/broadcast.

Jim: Let me ask you, uh, probably the most common thing we get, it’s a lil dangerous to say because everybody is living a different experience, but a common issue is busyness. I mean, a lot of households now, both husband and wife are working. Those with kids, I mean the pressures are immense. The good news is, just hang in, it’s not gonna last forever and it’s gonna be really rewarding at the end in my opinion. Uh, but that is the big issue, busyness in life and you know what? If you knew our schedule… We can’t do a date night. You don’t know how busy we are. Work, work, work, work, work. The kids, school, sports clubs, uh, there’s no time for us. What do you say?

Jay: One of the things and- and I don’t think this is necessarily biblical, but I think we can all understand is Satan doesn’t necessarily want us bad, he wants us busy.

Jim: Yeah, that’s true.

Jay: Because when we’re bad, we know we’re doing something against the Lord’s will.

Jim: Huh.

Jay: … But often times, when we’re busy, “Well, Lord I’m doing this for my wife, I’m doing this for my family, I’m doing this for the church, I’m doing it for the community.” And we don’t realize, that every time we say yes to something, we’re also saying no to something else.

John: Hmm.

Jim: Speak to the issue of the balance of work and home life and a- a- again, so often this is out of kilter, you know?

Laura: Yes.

Jim: It’s- it’s not healthy. Eh, people must struggle to believe they can have both. I mean, I think the Lord will honor you with a solid eight, nine hours committed to work. If you work hard, you don’t, you know-

Laura: Mm-hmm.

Jim: … dilly-dally, and you do the job well, you should be able to get home. And if the- your employer says, “Hey, I’m a lil worried that you’re not staying late,” tell him, “Hey, I’ve got a priority.”

Laura: Right.

Jim: “It’s called my family.”

Laura: Exactly. And I think… I know we said these words on our wedding vows, and I’m not sure, uh, in the traditional vows you say a phrase similar to, “Forsaking all others, I thee wed,” and we say that and we think forsaking all others, that means I’m not gonna have an affair, I’m not gonna, you know-

Jim: Hmm.

Laura: … Get involved in pornogra-… But others can be your work, your children, schedules, uh-

Jay: Volunteerism.

Laura: Wanting to make a lot of money, volunteer-… Others is anything that takes you away from this relationship. I mean, the first most important relationship decision you ever make in your life is whether you are going to follow Jesus. The second is who you are gonna marry. And there’s no other book in the bible… You know, there’s not a book in the bible dedicated to money, there’s not a book of the bible dedicated to-

Jay: Volunteerism.

Laura: … volunteerism, or your work, but there is a book, Song of Songs, dedicated to marriage and the love story between a man and woman. And when you take that relationship and s- a- as we all do, my kids, you know, I’ve got kids in the house they’ve got to come… My husband can take care of himself, he doesn’t need me to do this, that or the other. Or we allow work to take over, um, we’re really negating that second most important relationship in our life. And it’s really… It is hard, it’s hard to say. I mean we work together, we do everything together. (laughs).

Jay: Really, that’s what I prayed for years ago.

Jim: Well that’s why you’re here today.

Laura: Yeah.

Jim: We wanna help you with that.

Group: (laughs).

Laura: And it’s hard to say, “You know what? Let’s close the office door.”

Jay: Hmm.

Laura: “And let’s go out to lunch and not talk about the ministry, or what’s coming-”

Jim: It’s a discipline.

Laura: It is. It’s a discipline. That’s the intentionality. And I think to get a work-life balance you have to be inten-… and you have to communicate about it.

Jim: Let me ask you this, what’s a destination mentality and how does that affect couples?

Jay: People think, if we just get this, or if we accomplish this, or when we get there. There is no there-there, because for humans we’re intrinsically desired to want more. And so it-

Jim: Huh.

Jay: … to enjoy the journey, even when you are walking through the desert. Realizing i- if in fact God is in control, then God is in control. Laura and I were privileged to be speaking at a music festival, and Steven Curtis Chaplin was on right before us.

Jim: Wonderful friend. He’s good.

Jay: And it was the first concert he did after losing his child.

Jim: Wow. Yeah.

Jay: And he said… He sang the song, “He gives and takes away. He gives and takes away. My heart will still say blessed be the Lord.” And he said, “If I can’t sing that in the midst of what I’ve just gone through, then I can’t sing that when things are going great.” And so instead of saying, “When we get here,” saying, “As we go.” And again, being of a certain age, uh, you realize that there really are seasons. And when you’re 30 and- and don’t… Haven’t experienced a lot of seasons in your life, and it’s really hard. You just gotta know. And take it from those of us that have been there. This, too, will pass. (laughs)

Jim: Yeah.

Laura: Mm-hmm.

Jay: You know? It really will.

Laura: And I think a lot of couples, especially younger couples, when we get our first job and we’re secure in that. We’ll work on that for like maybe seven or eight years, then we’ll have children. And then when we’ve had two or three kids and as they’ve grown up, then we’ll do this. And we look for these, um, milestones in life, and when they don’t happen, then the expectation is now what- now what do we do? And so, instead of working- working towards those destinations, so to speak, when we get to this, when we get to that, when we make this amount of money, then we’ll do this. You’re not allowing the Lord to kinda direct what He has for you and where He wants your marriage and your family to go.

Jim: Yeah, that’s good.

Jay: What I put it in the microwave, He takes out and puts it in the crockpot.

Group: (laughs).

Jim: That’s a good analogy. Couples can tend to fall into patterns of criticizing each other and I mean it’s-…

Laura: (laughs).

Jay: Hmm.

Jim: We call it pushing your buttons, or you know, and that’s-… at Hope Restored, which is our marriage intensive, that’s a lot of what the counseling is, is how to reorient couples on how to communicate with each other to be more effective and get a better outcome, rather than just pushing a button and going, “Arg I’m so…”

Laura: (laughs).

Jim: You know, it’s such a deception. I irritated her so much, I don’t think she loves me anymore.

Laura: (laughs).

Jim: I mean that’s not the goal.

Laura: Right. Uh, well, we, uh… We are really good at-… Jay’s love language, his primary love language, is Words of Affirmation.

Jim: Oh, that’s good.

Laura: And my spiritual gift is sarcasm.

Group: (laughs).

Laura: So we really have to work-

Jim: Your love language is sarcasm.

Laura: Yeah.

Jim: Yeah.

Laura: So we have to really work-… I have to really work at my words, and what I say, and how I say it because we can- I can-… Not meaning to. I- I- I see it as humor. I think I’m funny. And I am, a lot of the time.

Group: (laughs)

Jim: And I am funny.

Laura: I just will let you know that.

John: What’s his problem?

Jim: At Jay’s expense.

Laura: That I am funny, um, but I have to realize what my words come across as.

Jay: And for me, I’m a type A driven driven person, who has serious tone of voice issues. And I can make Laura feel two inches tall just with my tone of voice. And one of the things that we’ve come to really try to keep at the forefront of my mind as we’re- as we’re communicating each other is, i- if Christ is in you, and Christ is in your spouse, the way you speak to your spouse-

Jim: Hmm.

Jay: … is the way you speak to Christ. And that is mind-blowing and I- I never really comprehended that until I realized that Jesus is living in her. And when I speak to her in belittling ways, that is not a celebration.

Jim: Um, yeah, another great way to think of that is, you- you know, you thought you father-in-law was something. Well her Dad spiritually is something too. (laughs).

Jay: Right. Exactly. (laughs)

Laura: Right.

Jim: That’s the Lord.

Laura: Exactly.

Jay: That’s right. That’s exactly it.

Jim: So when you talk to her, that does put a little brake on your tongue.

Jay: Yeah.

Jim: Hopefully.

Jay: Well hopefully, yes.

Jim: Not always.

Laura: Well, and the other thing… our pastor was just talking about this last weekend, was that… he said this phrase, and I hope I get it right, he-… Eh, we’ve been doing a series on marriage and he said, “Inside each and every one of us, is royalty and foolishness.”

Jim: Hmm.

Laura: “And your words will bring out one or the other.”

Jay: Hmm.

Jim: Wow, that’s good.

Laura: So when you’re speaking to your spouse, the words that you use are gonna bring out either the child of God or the foolish sinner. And I- I- we were- I was like, “Man, I keep getting convicted about that sarcasm.” (laughs).

Jay: (laughs).

Jim: Wow. That’s- that’s a good parenting note, expression as well.

Jay: Yup.

Laura: Mm-hmm. Exactly.

Jay: Very good.

Jim: Because I think that’s very true in parenting, maybe even more so, you know.

Laura: Yeah. Exactly.

Jim: Uh, the more you push-

Jay: W- what are you going to bring out of your kid?

Jim: … The more… The- the bigger the expectation.

Laura: Mm-hmm.

Jay: Hmm.

Jim: The more you push for perfection, it’s likely you’re gonna get the foolishness cause they’re rebelling against it. Eh, y- you mention small arguments, uh, Jay. That there was right and wrong in the way that you thought. You talked about that black and white thinking, so maybe it was early in your marriage… Like you needed to win every argument or what were you expressing there?

Jay: That was actually more Laura than me.

Group: (laughs).

Jay: She- she-… Because she’s the third of fourth-

Jim: I was trying to give you a softball, buddy.

Jay: Well she’s the third of four children so she was rarely right-

Laura: Yeah, that’s me.

Jay: But… Okay so, I grew up the son of a minister who was in the military.

Jim: Okay.

Jay: So I- I- I live with nothing but fear and guilt. And everything was black and white.I mean, I-… and I say this honestly, there was a proper way to fold your underwear.

Jim: Oh yeah.

Jay: Yeah.

Jim: I had that stepdad.

Jay: Yeah. Yep. And so, um, you know, to me everything was black and white. Laura grew up very much in a home where things weren’t black and white. They-… And they weren’t gray, like fuzzy, we’re gonna fray the edges gray, just like… There’s different perspectives. And I-… For the longest time I couldn’t understand that. “No! My perspective is right.” You know? I mean, that’s the way it was, u- until someone said to me, “Jay, if you were both the same, one of you wouldn’t be necessary.”

Jim: Hmm.

Jay: And I was like… hm.

Laura: I actually believe I said it to him.

Jim: (laughs).

Jay: (laughs).

Jim: So did you ever ask her about how she folded the underwear?

Laura: (laughs).

Jay: No, I just folded it myself.

Jim: Honey, there’s a better way to do that.

Jay: Yeah, I just did it myself.

Jim: (laughs).

Jay: (laughs).

Jim: That’s pretty funny.

Laura: Yeah, I don’t fold-… We fold clothes together, because he folds his own clothes. (laughs) I fold my clothes because, we do it different.

Jim: (laughs).

Laura: But yes, because it was very much-

Jay: And if you get a lot of laundry, it’s a date night.

Group: (laughs).

Jim: Yeah. That’s how I gotta think of that. That’s a good idea. You know, when you think about what we talked about today, these are kind of the basics. These are the right things. But it’s amazing how the basics slip away.

Jay: Hmm.

Jim: Or are never put in place, and that’s why so many couples struggle.

Laura: Mm-hmm.

Jim: Cause they’re not doing these fundamentals, like if you were playing a sport like baseball or something-

Laura: Right.

Jim: … you would want to do these fundamental-… You gotta throw the ball, you gotta hit the ball.

Jay: Ah, we’re both sports fans and two of our favorite coaches, Vince Lombardi, after they lost the 1960 Super Bowl in the fourth quarter. First day of training camp day, classic, he held up a football and he said, “Gentlemen this is a football.”

Jim: Right. (laughs).

Jay: “And until we learn how to care of this, we’re not going to be able to do anything else.”

Jim: Hmm.

Jay: Then my favorite coach of all time, John Wooden, uh, the the Wizard of wall- of Westwood, won ten national championships. The first thing he taught his freshmen? How to tie their shoes.

Jim: Hmm.

Jay: How to tie their shoes. You don’t get any more basic than tying shoes, but that’s the first thing he taught em. Because back in the day, if you didn’t tie your shoes properly, you got blisters and then you couldn’t play.

Jim: (laughs).

Laura: And I th-

Jay: So you’re right about the fundamentals.

Jim: The fundamentals.

Jay: Yes.

Laura: I do think we have to remind couples, though, that marriage is hard work. Yes there’s joy, yes there’s celebration, but it takes years of hard work before you really become prolific-

Jay: Prolific.

Laura: … at it.

Jim: Mhmm.

Jay: Right.

Jim: Yeah. The, ah… You know, a good place to end would be on this idea of encouragement. So let’s go there. Both of you mention your thoughts on the importance of encouraging your spouse. Uh, one another, from the wife’s perspective. So what would you say to- toward encouragement?

Laura: You know, I think it’s important… I encourage women to, if you could wake up every morning and before your feet hit the floor on the side of your bed, think of one thing, positive, that you’re gonna focus on your husband today. Whether it’s that he came home early from work, or he picked up his dirty clothes off the floor-

Jim: Hooray. (laughs).

Laura: … or just that he went to work to provide for the family. But whatever it is, find something… Just put that in your mind that you’re gonna find something today that is positive, and you’re going to speak it out loud. Because again, when you speak it, the words you use are gonna either bring out the royalty or the foolishness.

Jim: Yeah. What do you think, Jay?

Jay: I would say, gentlemen, use your five senses to say the words, “I love you.” Say it, let her see it in your actions, let her feel it in your touch, let her smell it (laughs) in your hygiene, and- and let her taste it when she kisses you.

Jim: Hmm.

Jay: Encourage her with your love and use all five senses, because she really- she needs that. That’s- that’s-

Jim: Yeah.

Jay: … that’s what the word cherish means.

Jim: That’s good.

Jay: All of this encompassed.

Jim: Jay and Laura, great insights. Thanks for being with us.

Jay: Great to be here.

Laura: Thanks for having us.

Jim: This has been so good, and to the listeners and viewers, I hope that we’ve encouraged you today. I- I think it was lighthearted but had some power punches in there to remind couples on what to concentrate on. You know, the Bible says that married people should be delighted by each other, now some couples just heard that and went, “Really?”

Laura: (laughs)

Jim: And others went, “Yeah.”

Jay: Hmm.

Jim: And-

Jay: Rejoice in the wife of your youth.

Jim: Yeah. And that’s the aim. We’ve got many tools here at Focus on the Family to help you, one is- is our marriage assessment.

John: Yeah, that’s a great one.

Jim: I think we’ve had over 1.1 or 1.2 million people take that assessment. It’s free. It’ll show you what you’re doing well and what you might need to work on a little bit, and then attach a lot of resources to get that done. Course, we’ve got this create resource here, Celebrate Your Marriage: 365 Daily Devotions for Busy Couples, that’s gotta be just about everybody. Jean and I started this morning, so we did, uh, the date, the proper date. We actually did two because we liked it so much.

Laura: (laughs)

Jim: So a- aren’t we high achievers?

Laura: (laughs)

Jay: You are. You are.

Jim: And so… Anyway, if you can make a gift of any amount, we’ll send a copy of the devotional as our way of saying thank you for being part of the ministry and helping other couples.

Jay: Hmm.

John: Yeah. Donate today and help us help couples worldwide to have stronger marriages. Uh, you can donate and request that book, Celebrate Your Marriage when you call 800, the letter A, and the word FAMILY. 800-232-6459 or stop by focusonthefamily.com/broadcast for all the details. Coming up next time, reasons why you should consider homeschooling for your family.

Preview:

Monica Swanson: I find that I’m a more relaxed, happy mom when I’m home with my kids all day than I was in that one hour rush to get them out the door to preschool, or during the bewitching hour before dinner when they were trying to do homework, and I had papers to sign, and a lunch to pack.

End of Preview

John: And on behalf of all the team here, thanks for joining us today for Focus on the Family with Jim Daly. I’m John Fuller, inviting you back next time as we once again help you and your family thrive in Christ.